That's it against this system. Let's take our daughter a little bit. That was standing until we forgot that. Okay. We might need like a small timing device and maybe a bell. Meaning just like, you know, here's a small but one thing. And a bell? Maybe, I'm not sure. Is this okay? but it was just that one was

[02:00]

That's kind of very futile for us. We're not going to have the TV. No one asked me for TV. OK. Yeah, as more of a Dharma talk kind of thing. At least that's been my assumption so far. Can't get in as an administrator on this computer.

[04:01]

And a microphone for . Oh, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You've got a . Oh, you can't until there are three people in the room. . Sorry. . So they should be in that card. Yes. Hello?

[05:43]

Sorry, what was that? I mean, it doesn't really make a... Do you have a little background on this? Yeah. On the bottom, sharp of that, correct. Hello. Thank you.

[12:11]

Can we even give you any idea where we must have said, David? Yeah, I would think. Oh, OK. . [...] I'm going to do an offline in three dollars. Hello.

[15:37]

Hello. So, I wanted to start by welcoming everyone. And I think that the time for this meeting, normally Wednesday nights, we start at 7.45, not 7.30, so I realized that after it was on the schedule. So we may, people may show up in like 15 minutes. So we'll deal with that when that happens. So how many of you here are part of the practice period? Sorry, how many of you are not part of the practice period who just kind of came in? Welcome. Is everyone here for the first time?

[16:40]

All right, excellent. So for those of you who are online, I don't know how many of you are here for the practice period or if you're just zooming in because it happens to be a Wednesday night. Not sure I can tell. Ah, hello. So I wanted to start with a kind of like an overview of what I think we're gonna do tonight. In lieu of a normal Dharma talk, I will be doing some talking, but I want it to be interactive this evening, and I want us to explore some of the ways in which community is developed and nourished and harmonious. In particular, we're in the middle, we're at the very start, we're one week into our winter practice period, the topic of which is on Zen precepts in daily life.

[17:50]

And normally during a practice period, so for those of you, I don't know how many people here have been in practice periods before, but I'll just say normally a practice period is a time that in Zen, where we get together and in a dedicated kind of intensive way, we kind of up our practice for a period of time, anywhere from a number of weeks to a number of months. Sometimes we do this in a monastic setting where everything outside of practice period kind of dissolves away from one's consciousness because it's all that's happening is the practice period. And then here at city center, because we're an urban temple and we're open to the wider world, it's kind of hard to have that dissolving into practice period. So it's much more porous and you kind of have to work a little bit harder to get that intensity, the intensity of practice, the immersion.

[19:04]

It's harder to be immersive in practice However, some of the key elements of a practice period, which is a community of practitioners who get together for a certain time period, some of the key elements include increased zazen, increased meditation time, more opportunities for silence, for appreciating silence with one another, and being in community with one another in a non-verbal, but body-to-body way. There's a lot of emphasis on community engagement, although I don't know if it's really articulated as such. It's more like, by being in a practice period, the community engagement kind of runs through the whole thing. We do this by committing to a schedule,

[20:05]

together, so we have a daily schedule. We take up the practice of sitting together and chanting together, bowing together, working together sometimes. Normally we would have community meals, but because we're in a renovation right now, we're not doing that as, we're not able to, we don't have a shared kitchen. And then also practice periods involve studying something together and being at Dharma talks on the topic of the practice period. And then there's a shared commitment in a practice period to following a certain set of guidelines of practice. In normal practice periods, this night, this Wednesday evening event, the first Wednesday after the opening. We opened last Wednesday. Normally the Wednesday afterwards is a time dedicated to going over what's called the shingi.

[21:10]

Does anybody here not know what shingi means? The meaning of the word shingi? So the shin of shingi is heart and the gi is rules or principles. So it's a It's a, that's what it literally means. Shingi literally means that, the heart of the rules. But it's kind of the, in a monastery, it's the monastic guidelines for practicing together. And you can look up our founder, A.A. Dogens, like when he started his first monastic communities in the 1200s, he adapted his Shingi. from what he learned in China when he was a monk there. And then we here at San Francisco Zen Center have a shingi as well. And I should have asked for a screen today.

[22:18]

Would it be? It'll take a few minutes. But it's possible? It's possible, yeah. Thank you, Dan. I'll have some prompts and things that I'll refer to on a screen, and I can share screen. Oh, is that messing with things? That wireless device. Turn this off. If I take it out to the guide town, will it help? Take away this defilement. Now he's noticing the buzz as well. And reverberation on my computer. Apologies for the bumbling through technology.

[23:27]

So, other elements. besides just another aspect of practice period, I'll just say, is having face-to-face meetings with teachers, whether it's or practice discussion. It's a way of, I mean, it happens outside of practice period. All of these things happen outside of practice period. It's just that this is kind of the collective group effort to hold that container together. So I wanted to, well, to say that Normally, here at San Francisco Zen Center, practice periods, people come in who don't live here. There's people who are residents who live at San Francisco Zen Center. Some work for San Francisco Zen Center. Some work outside the building and do other things, but live and practice at San Francisco Zen Center. And then other people live in the neighborhood and come in, like some of you, or we live close by, are joining for the practice period. Normally, we invite...

[24:31]

people to come in as residents for that time. And unfortunately, because of the renovation, we can't do that. So it is largely the people who are here that don't live at San Francisco Zone Center are commuting in. And so normally in a practice period, there are people who are residents, both residents who work for the center and then there's residents who work outside the center. Then there's the non-residents or wider Sangha neighborhood, people from the neighborhood who come in. And then over the pandemic, things really exploded online. And so we also have people practicing in the practice period who are here online. And so the net becomes wider. And this time around, we're doing this new thing, which we're kind of exploring what it is. which is not having incoming residents for the practice group.

[25:32]

So I wanted to say a little bit about the shingi and then, let's see. So I wanna talk about the shingi a little bit. I wanna have, just to show it, aha. I'm gonna put it up and share my screen. Can you give me share screen? You should be able to do that. That's not. You may have a hard time seeing that from afar, but let's see. Using that. It's a little better.

[26:38]

So the opening line of this shingi, or the pure standards guidelines for conduct, from Suzuki Roshi, all students should be like milk and water, more intimate than that even, because we are all good friends from past lives, sharing eternal Buddha nature as each one's own. Just sit and see what happens. Following the rules lets you find yourself. The rules are not something to restrict you, but something to support your practice. And then, it's the document, one of the first things it covers is the topic of this practice period, the 16 Bodhisattva precepts. So, I wanted to just say that based on this grouping of rules, which, you know, where do they come from? Where do we, you know, do we just make them up?

[27:44]

Anyone? Where'd they come from? Sorry? They are adapted from Dogen's pure standards, although Dogen's pure standards are much more lengthy. Where'd they come from? From Buddha. Originally, the Vinaya came from Buddha. Yes, the Vinaya, the monastic guidelines. And how did the Buddha decide upon these rules of conduct? Yeah, he adapted it to what was going on. So he didn't start out with like, let's see, let me think of some rules. These are the rules. Things happened and students would go to the Buddha and say, this happened. Can you please mediate for me between this other monk and myself? And the Buddha would say, yeah, don't do that. Stop that. And so the shingi, or the venaya was born and then grew into what we have today as this shingi.

[28:48]

So the question that I have, the reason why I wanted to bring us together in a community meeting format is is I wanted to discuss how the precepts, in your experience of practicing with the precepts, and if you're new to the precepts, you can look at them and, let's see, these are not all of them. There's the refuges and there we go. There they all are, so 16 of them. How do they promote community harmony And there's some obvious ones, right? Don't kill. Like, if you're killing, it doesn't really, it kind of detracts from community harmony. Don't lie, don't steal, don't misuse sexuality. So all of these are not just intended to help us live in harmony with one another. That's kind of maybe a side benefit to following the precepts.

[29:54]

The precepts are there to become Buddha. to recognize oneself as Buddha. So these are sometimes described as characteristics of a Buddha. Buddha just does these things or doesn't do these things. So I would like to explore people's experience with working with precepts and not just like the meaning of like, the obvious literal meaning of these precepts like don't kill, but to explore the ways in which we actually do these things and how they affect living in community or living in a harmonious community. So I'll invite you to get into groups to discuss some of these things and then we'll return to a larger group and speak more from what came up in your groups. And then I'm also really interested in the question of not just the Shingi or the 16 Bodhisattva precepts, but what other principles or practices or attitudes or attributes, characteristics, qualities are there that are either essential to or highly appropriate to developing, maintaining harmony in communities.

[31:19]

So, that aren't necessarily covered in the shingi or in the precepts. The shingi, as you can see, so the precepts, as you can see, are... There's the three refuges, taking refuge in Buddha, Dharma, and Sangha. There's the three, what are called the three pure precepts of avoiding bad things, cultivating good things, and living for the benefit of others. I think people really... resonate with the third pure precept I find really is a positive feeling like if you can just do that right live for the benefit of all beings then these other things may just come from that right so but what other things contribute to nourishing harmonious community and what and then what things detract from

[32:23]

community harmony. So I think I'm going to start with having the discussion, a discussion. Let me see if I can do this. Can you see this? Well, this is the benefit of. All right, can you read that? There we go. Okay. So for those of you who are online, Dan, are you able to break people out? Maybe in groups of four, three, four, or five, just about four people, to kind of reflect on these questions with one another. If you don't have anything to say, feel free to just pass and listen.

[33:25]

Or in your time to share, you can ask questions as well. Or say things that you're curious about. Does this exercise make sense? Are there any questions before we start? I think we'll go into groups of four and each person think about having basically three minutes. We don't have that much time together. So three minutes each. And maybe I'll ring the bell every three minutes. And Dan, maybe when I ring the bell, you can convey that to the breakout rooms. All right, please arrange yourselves. And if you don't know one another, please introduce yourself. Yes. Yeah, got it. All right, thank you. Once everyone is settled in their group, I'll go ahead and start timing.

[34:41]

So you all have 12 minutes total. I'm going to ring the bell each in three-minute increments, and you can arrange yourselves as needed. We undo the... Thank you. Well, I'll just test it with that. Thank you.

[36:04]

Thank you. [...] Especially, you know, some of you just let people see what's happening. You know, I'm sorry, [...] I'm sorry. Yeah, actually, it's what I'm starting to do. You're starting to get a bounce ball. [...] Yeah, I think so. Yeah, I think so. Yeah, I think so.

[37:08]

Yeah, I think so. Yeah, I think so. Yeah, I think so. We should say that, you know, some, like, [...] you know There are cases that would probably happen, you know. Since they only know what we have, they're just something. I don't know what the experience is happening. Why do you think they'll see the difference? Yeah, the difference is how it's going. So, you know, the mistake has made it. That's confusing. Amazing. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, [...] yeah.

[38:31]

All right, to the chair of [...] the chair. It's a young girl, right? It's a young girl. [...] Do you want to see everybody on the precept parts there? I think I'll be practicing on precepts.

[39:34]

For me, there's a... Well, let's have to go first. So, I don't think it's important to me, but I think it's important to me. It makes sense to me how I like it. It makes sense to me. [...] It's not space. It's not space. It's [...] not space.

[40:39]

Yeah. [...] Not too often used to go first. We don't care for often because it's a place to go first. But this is still a place to be left to use. It's [...] a place to be left to use. You need to see it in class. We graduate on this day.

[41:40]

You need to have me that's 30 years. That's, it's, [...] it's. being able to hold them up with a sort of flexible CFO and whatever. Because each person matters, it's like, team, what you're saying, [...] what you're saying. And I don't know what's wrong with this. It's just that it's like, there's like, it's like, I guess, like, wine. It's like, maybe it's [...] like,

[42:55]

I'm sorry, [...] I'm sorry. This is, uh, when I read that, you know, it's nice. It's just, I think it's more of that, like, you know, like, you can do it for yourself. It's just, you know, like, you can do it for yourself. You [...] can do it for yourself. I'm sure you can even realize my lipos snagged on something.

[43:58]

I'm sure you can even realize my lipos snagged on something. I have to please snagged on something. See, because I am certain that you're going to need your lipos snagged on something. That's, that's, [...] that's. You know, that was just the fact which... Don't know what that was. Well, I think it's a box of me and it was not exactly him. So, yeah, sorry to be a little bit. I can just start talking about how he talked about his words. Just speaking about his words, I would think there were things that he was saying, I heard to be able to help with the layers, you know, for me, I could be leaving his hair into a bus, and I knew he'd stop at that, and I knew he'd say, I knew what it was, and I didn't take a scene at times to think about what he saw as a man, and I didn't take a picture of [...] a man. Yes, I'm just saying, I'm not afraid to do this, but you've got to touch that scene, and I'm real keen.

[45:01]

So, I don't want to hear both of them, but it's in general, and [...] it That was the question. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. But just with those questions, that it just happened, you know, is that right and wrong?

[46:17]

You know, and the other shows, yeah. Okay. With the manifesting your daily life. Yes. Yes. Yes. That to me, that's brilliant. That's a brilliant report. [...]

[47:23]

He's a little bit different. [...] of the heart. It's like these four years, it makes you more often to just the area of this. It's not cheap, but what was it? You know, I think it's a strong example of the average practice. It's the best part of you. [...] Maybe I don't think I understand, but you're suffering from the body. You're suffering from the body.

[48:23]

You're suffering from the body. [...] Do you want to go back twice? You can sit where you are. We're going to come back to a larger group. You can get comfortable wherever you are. So I think the breakout rooms are starting to come back. Yes, the microphone. That would be great. All right, welcome back, everyone.

[49:29]

I wonder, so Kevin has the microphone, and I'd like to hear from anyone here in the room or online if what came up that was surprising, or maybe not surprising, but that you want to share. This particularly show in your small group. And please raise your hand if you'd like to speak. Raise your hand. Yes. Yes, we go. I think everybody agreed, if I can speak for the group, that they were challenging and clarifying and helpful in a variety of ways. But one thing that came up for me and at least one other, or maybe all of us, was that the communications agreements that we have upstairs on the wall and the particularities of diversity, inclusion, and egalitarian approach are not highlighted in the Shingyi as we see it in the precepts, even though it's not absent from there.

[50:55]

I think we agreed on that too. But there's a huge value in contemporary life. And I think it's in the heart of a lot of our communications agreements here to focus or to be attentive to those details. So let's see. Let me see if I can share that. There they are. There they are. This is what Heiko is referring to, the communication agreements adapted from East Bay Meditation. And they are practices that enhance our ability to be with one another, especially of people who come from different backgrounds.

[51:56]

or just have different ideas about how to live in community. So I'm just scrolling through it because I can't show all of it at one time without it being this too small. Thank you, Heiko. Anyone else? And Valerie, too. So we have Ellen and then Valerie. So possible other ways of phrasing the precepts or other precepts. One is don't withhold. So sometimes we have to disengage, but to not engage is a way of withholding. I mean, sometimes we need that, especially given our living circumstances. But don't withhold. Continue to engage. Don't withhold affection.

[52:59]

And kind of don't shut yourself off. Don't. Don't shut yourself off. Don't shut yourself off. And then the flip is be kind, which I don't know that there's a precept that actually flat out says be kind. Kind of live and be lived for the benefit of all beings. But I don't know. Personally, I find be kind. Being kind. To be just a helpful little mantra. Thank you. Yes. Yes, I will end that. Dan, can you patch them through, or do you need me to read the question? No, no, Valerie. Valerie can unmute and speak. Yes, Valerie. Oh, you are muted. She's not muted. Hold on just a moment, Valerie. You need to turn something on. You can ask Valerie to speak.

[54:02]

Valerie, you can speak. Not coming through. Not getting it online. Oh, you are hearing it on, you're hearing Valerie online, everyone? Thumbs up. Yeah, okay, thank you, Mari. How about if I, can I unmute myself? Let me try this, there may be feedback. OK, Valerie, can you speak? Can you hear me now? Yes. Yeah. Hi, everybody. Just a quick comment. I think we're going to use a little more . There was some discussion going on. But just hearing other people share, you heard me about, you know, it takes on certain three steps, which are kind of very helpful. So I thought they'd have a whole option to say I've learned them.

[55:10]

I just go through them. I use them the best that I can. But someone made a comment about the preceptive of my intoxicating self, relating it to not drugs or substances, but using media or using things to distract yourself, because I realized which I had to find myself, but I realized that it does have to do with, it does affect my ability to be mindful on a different basis. I never really thought of that, so it was great that the person in my group mentioned it that way. And also, you know, bringing stuff about others or, you know, speaking partially or whatever, and how speaking partially about people can be a way of bonding with other people, and how to, you know, help to work differently with that.

[56:14]

You know, like, not use, you know, like, that philosophy. That's a great approach, like, by bonding with other people. And I never got that. [...] I always would see it myself. you know, how that works. So I'm grateful to my people in my group for what they shared and how they helped me get some new useful perspectives on precepts and how they, but thank you. Thank you. Yes, Griffin. wonderful opportunity to really see that I don't experience what I understand.

[57:16]

I'm in a community now which is filled with people who have or have thought about deeply their best intentions and yet because now the community that we are attached to and our worldview got bigger, those intentions often are falling short when it comes to the actual impact. I thought everybody thought that my puppy was cute. Well, guess what? This is a bigger community, not everyone does. I sat down at a table where everybody had a big plate of bacon. And I jokingly said, oh, I guess I'm not at the Buddhist table. And everyone stood up and said, no, we're all Buddhists. And, you know, deep assumptions that I just have to be more and more open and see that what I think is good and what I think is good intentions, this is a bigger community and more people to...

[58:35]

more worthy, good, honest people who don't have the same basic assumptions that I have. And it comes as a shock. Thank you. So this leads me to another, I'm not gonna, we can't have time for more breakout rooms, but I wanted to ask the question, because it's already I've heard things like kindness, tolerance, open-mindedness. So these are some things that are maybe essential for community harmony, but what are some other attributes? Yeah, Toba. Hold on a second, mic coming. What came up for me was practicing with the precepts in a community builds trust. That would be another attribute.

[59:38]

Because we have some sense that we have similar values around things like being honest and making an effort to, as someone already mentioned, communicate with one another in an open way. and to be aware of the importance of kind speech, right speech. There's so much to learn about speech. There's that commitment to caring about what we do and say and how it affects one another that builds trust. Thank you. You need to have a basic level of safety, for example, feeling safe. to be able to have that trust even begin. So kindness, open-mindedness, trust.

[60:38]

Anything else? Yeah, Tim. Service. Things have to be done. Sweeping, painting, washing dishes, cleaning toilets. Yeah. Chipping in or just taking care. of the many, many things that need to be done. Household chores, yeah. Patience, I heard somebody say patience as well. What about forgiveness? It's pretty big quality. Tolerance. Anything else? Say the assumption you have been forgiven. Give me the mic, or, sorry, say that again, thank you, and I'll repeat you. We assume that we'll be forgiven even as we stumble along.

[61:43]

To assume that we'll be... We, yeah. We do assume that we will be forgiven. We trust that we will be forgiven even as we stumble along. And why do we trust that? Yes, Josh. I was going to say acceptance of others and ourselves in flaws and living by the precepts sort of gives a framework to accept those things that might be hard to otherwise live skillfully with. Yeah, I think that also there's a certain level of when you live with people who have made a commitment that also means there needs to be some form of accountability. And that's where forgiveness can come in more easily. If you don't have a basic sense of, yeah, we're on the same page here, that would be very hard to then have that trust and be able to, I guess forgiveness requires a certain level of inner composure and trustingness.

[62:58]

You don't necessarily need, you can forgive without acquiring anything of the person that you're forgiving to. I think Seishin, you have your hand raised? Why don't you go ahead and unmute. Here we go. Yes, thank you for bringing up forgiveness. I was going to mention it myself. Living in community means that you're going to be with people and people screw up. People do things intentionally or unintentionally that disturb, harm others, each other. And sometimes it's the most difficult to forgive that which, well, that person should know better. and thinking they have the best of intentions, so it must be personal.

[64:03]

And, you know, that kind of thinking just is going down the drain. And so I've got to practice forgiveness for the unenlightened and the enlightened both, because otherwise I will just... I will lose it. I will be useless. I will be a mass of emotions and anger and so forth. And, you know, that's harboring your will. You know, don't want to do it, but it's so easy to get drawn back in if I can't practice forgiveness. So, you know, I think it's a really vital quality when you're living in community just so that you can So you don't go into a murderous rage and kill everybody. Sorry, that's it for me. Thank you, Sachin.

[65:07]

I think along the same lines as forgiveness, it's just to have the ability to give people the benefit of the doubt. That goes along with trust as well. So even if you feel like somebody personally hurt you, or doesn't like you, or to always give some benefit of the doubt, and to be open to impermanence. Things change, everything changes. Yeah, Christian. Can you unmute? And then Terry. Yes, there we go. Thank you. I was thinking about kind of the flip side of forgiveness, which is owning your mistakes. And what came up for me was confession and repentance, which I think is different, but it's kind of the same spirit of being open to where you've gone wrong.

[66:15]

And I think verbalizing that can be really powerful for everyone. Yes, thank you. And actually, when we do our precept ceremony, our monthly precept ceremony, we start with confession and repentance. It lays the ground for being able to take on precepts. And again, that accountability. Yes, Terry? I have to say, I have a lot of trouble with the... concept of forgiveness, because it seems like throwing the responsibility back on the... I do reject the obligation to forgive, because it's throwing responsibility back on the person who was hurt, and it also seems like it's just a very, you know, Christian concept.

[67:16]

But I have recently had a conflict with a friend where she hurt me and was never willing to say something, acknowledge the understandability of how I felt. And I would not say I've forgiven her, but I saw that she was suffering from fear, from very, very concerned that I was mad at her. And that really alleviated, I felt compassion for her, you know? And that alleviated my anger quite a bit. But I have to say, it's just been in the context of this

[68:19]

this particular session that I've been going through those things in my mind and realizing, no, I want to alleviate her suffering. I don't want to forgive her, but I do want, I don't want her to suffer so much. Thank you. That's a wonderful reflection. Yeah, so we only have a minute or two before we end, but I do feel like studying the precepts, it's something that we could do every day as a daily practice. And when we can do this practice with others, it really opens up so much more than when we're just trying to do it by ourselves. So having the opportunity to discuss precept practice, I think, is just crucial in being able to open up to further... depths of the nuances of this question of how do I live in harmony in communities even within myself?

[69:30]

How do I live in harmony with myself, with my past, with my inner critics and so forth? So I think we are at the end of our time. I wanted to go into also the question of what detracts from, because there's some things that are really interesting that detract from community harmony that we may not think about, especially if you live in a community. For example, authoritarian structures that are not like benevolent, lack of transparency, conflict avoidance, right? These things can be detrimental to community harmony. So anyway, this was, I don't know how, I'd like to hear people's comments about how this went.

[70:35]

It's not really enough time, I think, to really deepen and dive in. Thank you all very much. We'll do the refuges together to end. Does anybody need the refuges? These are the taking refuge in Buddha, Dharma, and Sangha, and we chant these in Pali. Sing, song, Russian. I'll do three vows, and then we'll chant. Thank you.

[72:28]

Sorry. [...] . . . Thank you all for coming out tonight on this rainy night and for coming online for those of you who came online.

[73:53]

See you soon. OK, who was that, Tim? Oh, no, . Yes. There's something you want to say behind . Thank you very much, Dan, for bringing the television. That was surprisingly quick. I think it's the community plan. I'm looking at this.

[74:56]

Are you sure it is? Does the community like it? There's a bunch. Marsha started that. Oh, yeah? She brought one. Okay, that's it. Okay, that's it. That's great. Thank you. I just think I just really need to do it.

[76:17]

No, I said that on Facebook. I don't want to make that happen. Are you serious? No, I'm serious. I'll move on, sir. I'll move on, sir. Thank you very much.

[77:17]

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