Thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you for coming. My name is Doris, and I'm in the fifth week or so of training as a chuseau at MUNC, and it's very great and an honor, and it'll be great when it's over. And I want to talk about what I just did. Saying no. Saying no to a situation. Until last Monday, I was totally blank. I had no idea what I would like to talk about. And I watched my mind going, I knew I'm not the person. I won't give that talk. I'll ask Steve to give it.

[01:02]

He has more to say than me, you know. All my mind was about no, no, no. And an interesting thing is that here is a little ritual going on, like the sangha calls me shuso, and I'm supposed to say hi. Japanese for Japanese for yes. I'm supposed to say yes. So I am very aware when I, in my mind, say no, you know, the snow and yes is playing a great role actually the last months. And so it's not only a play between us, it's at the end of the show. So weeks training, there will be a ceremony and it's part of the ceremony that when somebody asks me or calls my name, I say yes, yes, yes. But actually, it's not only about the ceremony. Actually, it has started now, you know. I'm supposed to say yes. And sometimes it goes like, so, so.

[02:04]

And I say, hi, yes. And sometimes they're tired. Yes. And sometimes there's a, you know. Again, you're the 20th person today. And I'm supposed to say yes. Okay. Oh, no, no, no, no, no, no. So it's about saying yes and no, and it has a lot to do with me, and I hope it has a lot to do with you, otherwise it will be boring tonight. I hope you know a little bit what I'm talking about, so that this confession is not only about myself, but I hope that you find yourself a little bit in this story too. And then Steve, our abbot, pointed out that Vimalakirti, the first chapters of Vimalakirti are about reluctance and saying, no, the disciples of the Buddha are asked to visit somebody who is sick. And they say, no, you know, 15,000 disciples and 50,000 bodhisattvas saying, no, no, no.

[03:09]

And they all had the reasons not to visit that one person because that one person is very smart and they think that they might be embarrassed because that person has embarrassed them before. So they say no. I said, oh, then I'm not the only one. That's good. At least 65,000 others. So also they are reluctant. And then there were one, two other things that were my company the last weeks and months. And I think it was on Monday during a year or something that suddenly I knew, yeah, of course, how could I forget, you know? So reluctance is not new. I just forgot that I actually weeks ago, a month ago, I thought, oh, it's about growing up, becoming mature, going through these passages and rituals. Oh, that's actually the subject. Maybe I could talk about that. But then I was so blank and panicked that I had forgotten what I could talk about.

[04:09]

And here it is now. A mixture of running away saying no and saying yes and being on our journey. And the material I want to go along that inquiry is a, pardon me, it's a story I found in the Bible, Jonah. Jonah and the whale. I think you might at least, some people are nodding, you might at least know the title, and then there's a whale involved. That's usually what we know. And many people think it's a children's story. There are a lot of children's books about it. And it's a short chapter in the Bible, and I liked it because it's so human, because Jonah's a prophet, and he also says no. all the time he says no to God and I thought okay that fits and if you please don't be offended when you hear the word God and it's sometimes it sounds maybe very Christian you know I translated for myself God into the truth you know always when it says God spoke to Jonah I said oh the truth is speaking to Jonah or his inner voice so I hope that you find some interpretation for yourself that suits you

[05:38]

Okay, here we go. So the voice or truth or God said to Jonah, Arise, go to Nineveh, that great city, and preach against it, for their wickedness has come up before me. But Jonah rose to flee to Tarshish that's in Spain he fled to Tarshish from the presence of the Lord and went down to Joppa to the harbor and he found a ship going to Tarshish Spain so he paid the fare and went on board to go with them to Tarshish to flee from the presence of the Lord presence of Buddha presence of the truth so that's already a very strong image in the beginning he was asked to go to Nineveh which would be today Iraq.

[06:42]

And he says, no way. I won't go to Iraq. And he has good reasons. Maybe there's war going on. It's far away. He will be a stranger. And who is he to make a prophecy there? They might kill him, stone him. And he goes into the other direction, Spain, sunny beaches, Mediterranean. But that's more it. Was it the fear of preaching? Was it his good reasons because there's war going on or he didn't know the path? I don't know. The story doesn't tell us. But I want to point out tonight it's more the conditioned no. No, the automatic no. Of course, I know there are good reasons to say no and there are good no's and important no's and there are even books about speaking a good no but i'm speaking tonight about the no that is out of reluctance out of fear and unconscious um so i think his no was very unconscious like steve called it the two-year-old no like no no you know trying his little self no and um

[08:03]

When we say no, I feel sometimes when I say no, I feel myself more. It is that this no, because the ego, you know, gives some strength there. And I feel strong. And sometimes it feels very real. Yeah. I mean, who doesn't know that we want the sunny side of life and we don't want to go, you know, where we are told to go. Yeah, we are told to go. like I noticed that when I'm out in the courtyard, although the sun doesn't make it anymore over the roofs, I'm still putting my chair, you know, where's the sun, where's the sun, I can't just sit down and have lunch outside, I'm always looking for a better, sunnier spot, I think that's a good image for looking for the sunny side of life, and always adjusting, you know. putting salt into the soup, although I haven't even, you know, tried it yet, or better even soy sauce, because it's healthy, you know, all these adjustments, or the little nose, you know.

[09:11]

And it's scary sometimes when I watch from the morning to the evening, you know, when I, now I worked on it, so I watched it a lot, how many nose there are. It's like all day long. Scary a bit. but it's not hopeless because when we notice, something might change. Yeah, that's a quote from Eckhart Tolle. He says, it's the ego, and Steve pointed out that there are many parts of the ego saying, oh, Eckhart, probably gives it all one name, the ego, and he says the ego doesn't know anything than the no. The ego doesn't know anything than adjusting, wanting something else than the present moment. Yeah.

[10:13]

So this rehearsing the yes with my sangha here is doing it as a whole community is a good, yeah, what is it? I feel like... or reconditioned from saying no now they condition me to say yes and let's see what happens with that whether it's a better thing or more helpful thing so Jonah so he ran away to flee the presence of the Lord um But the Lord sent out a great wind into the sea, and there was a mighty tempest in the sea so that the ship was in danger of being broken. Then the sailors were afraid and cried, every man to his guard, and they threw the wares that were in the ship into the sea to lighten it. So the storm is coming. The storm stands, of course, for our stormy life.

[11:17]

Difficulties, problems, hindrances... Sometimes they are subtle, you know. I cut my finger a little bit, you know, because I was streaming while handling a knife. Sometimes they are bigger, you know, having accidents, being in an abusive environment. I think you know what I mean. Sometimes, yeah. Or bad health. So the ship was in danger of being broken. The life, his life, Jonah's life, was in danger of being broken. It could stand for our relationships, for our life. And T is not alone. No vice versa. People are around us. Friends, family, the Sangha. And when there's a lot going on in our life, it has an effect, of course, as we are interrelated.

[12:22]

for everybody so the sailors have to they don't even know what's happening to them and they don't know the reason so it affects the sailor and they have to throw their wares their goods into the sea to lighten the ship and so they are affected by Jonah's running away and Jonah what is with Jonah Jonah had gone down into the inner hold of the ship And he lay and was fast asleep. Good sleep. That's why I like the story so much. It's so human. And if you knew how much I slept the last nine months, I don't, yeah. So also there I recognize a lot, you know, this going to sleep stands, of course, for not wanting to see. at least on my part, I'm talking about myself now, you know, even not able to see because it feels too much, sometimes not wanting to see, sometimes just being conditioned and, you know, as I said, what I said about the no, also is going to sleep, can just be a very conditioned reaction to life, to what's happening.

[13:41]

So he doesn't even notice the storm. He falls into unconsciousness when things become difficult, like the storm. This is not good to you, I think. What I found interesting is, though, bringing sleepiness into relation with the spiritual path. I have another, I read another, I've got another nice source, Norman Fischer's Sailing Home. which I want to recommend. And here's at least two chapters about sleepiness, falling asleep, being sleepy and lazy, because Odysseus, the hero of this book, also falls asleep a lot. And Norman gives us a lot of great hints concerning our spiritual life. Our minds, addicted to clarity, sometimes wear down

[14:47]

with the effort to relax into the flow of our murky life. We become confused about what we are after, who we are, what we are doing. We know we want to return home to the person we were meant to be, to the life we know is really ours. But as soon as we come close to it, we lose confidence. We are turned around by the world's compelling images, And something tempting or distracting causes us to lurch in the other direction. Reading the same image. Paradox, ambivalence, and conflicting desires beset us. And even though we make an effort to sort it all out, we can't help ourselves. Worn out from the inner battle, we fall asleep at just the wrong time. sometimes even within sight of shore. And another quote.

[15:48]

Our unacknowledged ambivalence, and we have been pulling and hauling as hard as we can to keep it unacknowledged, wears us out. We fall asleep almost on purpose. And while we sleep, unruly forces within us stir up our self-destructive impulses. Or in one sentence, to put it all together, when the fatigue caused by inner spiritual conflict grows deep enough, we fall asleep. So that's just another aspect of that also, you know, showing effort and effort on the spiritual conflict have. That might be another reason of exhaustion and falling asleep. Back to Jonah. So the captain came to him and said to him, why are you sleeping?

[16:54]

Arise. Call up your God. Perhaps God will deliver us that we perish not. And they said everyone to his fellow, come, let us cast lots that we may know for whose cause this evil has come upon us. And the lot fell upon Jonah. Then they said to him, Tell us for what cause this evil has come upon us. What is your occupation? From what place are you from? What is your country? Of what people are you? And Jonah said to them, I'm a Hebrew, and I worship the Lord, the God of heaven, and who has made the sea and the dry land. And the men were exceedingly afraid and said to him, what have you done? For the men knew that he had fled from the presence of the Lord. That's again, it was in the beginning, you know, to flee from the presence.

[17:58]

presence of the Lord when we take the interpretation to flee from the presence of the truth to flee from the presence of the present moment you know suddenly it makes sense he's running away from your life he's running away from the present moment and running away from the truth big deal the sailors know that it can cost your life it can cost their lives actually So they are friendly, though. Jonah is not totally alone. They're sailors, friends, sangha. And when they ask him where you're coming from, in our Buddhist language, it's actually, you know, what is your intention? Why the hell are you running, running away? What's going on? What don't you want to face? And when he had told them everything, then they said to him, what shall we do that the sea may become for us?

[19:01]

For behold, the sea continues to be more and more, you know, against us. And Jonah said to them, take me up and cast me into the sea, so that the sea may be calm to you. For I know that for my sake this great tempest is upon you. So you could read it as, my friends, I'll help you. I don't want you to die instead of me, you know, throw me into the sea. The way I see it when we follow Jonah's path is he says, actually, I'd rather die. I'd rather die before I return. I'd rather die before I do what I'm told to do. I'd rather die before I say yes, because it's too much. It's too big. It's too exhausting. Going asleep and dying stand for the same, I can't deal with this, you know.

[20:07]

Again, he denies to meet the moment or his inner voice or how you want to call it. He denies truth. Something has called him and he is not ready yet. He doesn't want to meet it, receive it or meet it. He has heard it, but he misses the point in activity. I don't know whether you know that missing the point is actually a translation for sin, missing the point. For me, it's falling away from our alignment with our life. But, again, the sailors are not evil. They don't throw them into the water, yet they keep rowing. The friends row. They keep rowing. They try to help. We can also regard the sailors, actually, as parts of Jonah, if we continue this kind of looking at the story. We have parts in us that say, oh, come on, you can do it, you know, come on, come on, you can do it, and try, try a little bit harder.

[21:11]

So we do have those parts. It's not always all one-sided. Don't give up yet. So they row and row and row. Like our organs, you know, although we sometimes might intoxicate our organs or part of the bodies, you know, it doesn't collapse yet. There's always some signs before that. And, yeah, they have support. But nothing helps as the storm gets stronger and stronger. And finally, so they took up Jonah and cast him forth into the sea. And the sea ceased from its raging. So they finally do it. And it looks like the end, but it's just, it's not yet. What happens? It happens, actually it happens. What Jonah wanted to happen, happened. He was thrown into the sea. And it can't get worse.

[22:15]

It's... He falls, he falls, and sinks onto the ground of the sea. And that's another image, of course, in life. You know, it's not always going uphill. We fall, and it's going down again, and then it's up again, and it's down again. So this is one of Jonah's falls into the sea. Now the Lord had prepared a great fish. And it swallowed up Jonah. And Jonah was in the belly of the fish three days and three nights. And the men were greatly terrified from the presence of the Lord because the sea ceased raging. And they offered sacrifices and righteousness to the Lord and made vows. Of course, you can say, oh, you know, the mission worked. Now these sailors who have other gods turns to that god, but again, the level we are on, the interpretation would be if we regard the sailors as parts inside of us, the parts of us that understand, can acknowledge.

[23:36]

And... make vows and know about ceremonies and rites to support. And what the sailors were impressed by, I think, was when you say that they were impressed by God, actually, again, it would say they are impressed by the power of truth, by the power of how truth wants to manifest. I don't know whether you can follow me, so that Seas come immediately when they throw Jonah overboard and it looks as if there is a relationship and the sailors or parts of us see it. They see there is a relationship and that something wants to manifest there. And even if we can't or don't want to be part of that dance, that game.

[24:41]

The universe plays with us sometimes. The truth is going forward. It forces us to play with it. Sometimes it plays without us. Sometimes it looks as if life can't be lived anymore. It looks as if there's no other way than to fail and to fall overboard. Life is a continuous mistake, a continuous problem. As I said before, these up and downs in life, you know, are part of it. And Jonah and the story stands for that. So Jonah was swallowed by a whale, so he didn't die. And he is in the womb or belly of the fish for three days and three nights.

[25:45]

And I spare you the second chapter in the, I just give you the content. There is a turning point. He understands that he was safe and he wakes up. You know, the belly stands for me like for a cave or for some recovery place, maybe a nest. where he can heal, maybe sleep three more nights and get some more power and energy before the fish spits him out again at the coast, at his home. And in the womb of the fish, he thanks God or he recognizes something. He does something. He... Yeah, maybe I can say he finds his true self, finds at least for some moment his true nature. And he's ready to be spit out and life goes on.

[26:49]

And the second time when he's on the shore, the Lord came to Jonah the second time saying, Arise, go to Nineveh, that great city, and cry against in the proclamation which I tell you. And this time Jonah follows and He goes, he learned something. He will fall across something else, but not about this one. So he goes, enters Nineveh, and says, yet forty days, and Nineveh shall be overthrown. So he's doing his prophecy, and what happens? Surprise, surprise, the people believe him. He doesn't have to speak much. They believe him, they started to feast, they put on sackcloth and ashes on their heads, and also the animals may not eat and drink, and they believe him. And anyway, it's not destroyed. And Jonah is not happy with this at all.

[27:56]

It's embarrassing, you know. You're a prophet, you're sent out, you go there, you make this prophecy, and what happens? Nothing. That's embarrassing. So he's very angry with God, with the truth, and says, you know, why did you send me here in the first place, you know? I knew that you would forgive, and how do I look now? You know, I made a fool out of myself. And he goes onto a cliff, he leaves the city, and watches from that cliff, from that tide. point what will happen to the city and God or the truth or the inner voice gets in touch with him again and he sits out there in the sun and God sends let's grow a bush with big leaves so that he has some shade there and at night God the inner voice whatever we call it sends a warm and Jonah's very happy of course with that shade and with those big leaves and at night God sends a little worm and the worm kills the tree and so you know all the leaves get dry and they don't give shelter anymore and God also sends a storm and the storm breaks the tree or the bush and

[29:23]

There is no shelter anymore. So what was just given is taken away again. And again, Jonah says, God, you know, just let me die. It's too much. They need, and nothing is working out. Anyway, why can't I just die? I mean, I recognize that, repeating myself, again and again and again. He is... not healed I mean he is not enlightened forever it's a it's a struggle maybe sometimes moment after moment moment by moment again you know meeting the moment and being awake we don't have it and we fall back and again like a Buddhist story for me yeah So no more shade.

[30:24]

He wants to die again. And God gets in touch with him again, saying, And the Lord God, Lord Buddha, said to Jonah, Are you exceedingly grieved over the bush? And Jonah said, I am exceedingly grieved, even unto death. Again. Then the Lord Buddha said to him, You have had pity on the bush for the witch you did not labor, nor did you make it to grow. It just sprang up in a night and withered in a night. And should not I have pity upon Nineveh? And that's now the end of the story. Should I have not pity upon Nineveh, the great city, in which are more than 120,000 persons? that cannot discern between their right hand and their left hand, and also much cattle.

[31:28]

The cattle also feasted, I think, so that's why it's included here. So, what helps? It's a very short story, and I found all my reluctance and wanting to run away and a lot of no's. Maybe I can say, you know, wanting to go back to sleep, wanting to die in this story. And what helps? Is there a help for this struggle of getting up every morning and getting up from every fall? Can I say fall? Is there a noun? Every fall? Yeah? Yeah, I think that's, you know, if we don't have the ease and it can't always be a dance, then yes, I mean, we fall and we get up again. And the end, it says God's pity.

[32:32]

I mean, we use another word usually. We say compassion, empathy. And the empathy or the compassion not to destroy any way. Again, if I bring it back, to Ninivei being also part of us, the dark sides of us, the angry parts, the weak parts, the wicked parts, etc., the wickedness. Ninivei, if we go on to this level, could also be parts of us. And that means actually that in the beginning... we could have read it as that Jonah didn't want to go to Nineveh not to face his dark parts he wasn't ready to face himself so at the end what the Lord Buddha God is saying the teaching is that not only having empathy and compassion with

[33:41]

people and animals, but having empathy with those parts in us that are dark and rigid, you know, our parts that want to die. So I want to end with that it's about including our nos and including our yeses. and having empathy for them. So, you know, Noah's story from the Bible. I feel like I've got anything. Yeah. Anything you want to bring up? Anything that comes up?

[34:45]

Yeah. that all the time there's truth that comes up in a dream that it's sometimes in a language that you can look at it, but it's like what you're trying to be part of that. Oh yeah. Like that, within that, and I feel like sort of that, he was speaking like, you know, you can avoid God and kind of people was kind of doing well with kind of it, it's because Yeah, I would say there is a place for it. Maybe it happened in the whale, you know, where he recovered, it was a place of recovery, that nest, re-cover, re, and he actually discovered what he always knew, you know, that he can get up again and there is something else besides the snow.

[36:05]

Yeah. Sleep can be, again, a no, can be healthy. Sleep can be healthy. Yeah. Thank you. I think I heard you say that you saw yourself in this story. So I'm curious, what is your way up? Mm-hmm. Spontaneously, what came up, very honestly, what was immediately there, a bit embarrassing, but it's Steve. You know, speaking about the moment, you know, having Steve at my side, talking to him, feeling his energy and all the teaching, non-verbal teachings. I think he's my whale in the moment. My, yeah. And more, not only in the moment, but for long term, I think it's people, friends. I think it's people, yeah.

[37:05]

Is there anything else you could say about including the girls and the girls? More about including... Yeah, I think... I don't know whether that's an answer for you, but the moment we turn towards them and recognize them, see them... That's for me, I mean, that's the start. I can't always embrace my nose. Of course, I don't remember my way. I say no to the nose. Yeah. You mean how to work with them, how to embrace them? How to do them.

[38:13]

Mm-hmm. Yeah, I don't know how I'll end this sentence, so I just start. For me, in the moment I address or recognize a no, or a yes, but let's say with the no's maybe, I think that's the biggest part, seeing them. I'm sorry, does anybody else have something? I don't have a good answer. How do you include your nose, Jeanine? I'm just thinking about the .

[39:19]

I'm thinking about a very common behavioral trait where could reflect to the power of the same amount, take it yet, that everything would need. Someone asked you, like, the ultimate role or something. And they'd say, I'll leave the phone here, so that. And so then it's just kind of teaching it to the faculty that it's actually a form of no. And no, I would set to... Yeah, we got a present. Yeah. And... Actually, I started to develop this role, and every no is a yes. Because they would be refusing, and it's like, okay, we need to take care of the milk stool, and they're just like, they're just all, and we used to think that we have to give, like, the world might end if we do not believe that change.

[40:22]

And it's like, there's a lot of skill, And I'm also thinking about renunciation, when the great people... But that, to me, he was young, like... Like the great, like... I think the word is shipped around a lot, like we can make it, you know, very... Well, I would say it depends on the present moment, right? I mean, what the moment is for you. That's why there's no recipe, yeah. No, but we could watch, I mean, you can do it as an experiment.

[41:24]

tonight when you go home, whether you find yourself more in the no or in the yes. I know what you mean with the yes that can become automatic, but you can watch it and to make the experiment by yourself. My guess is that it's uttered more as a no. Was that a little bit more flesh for you in answer watching that? No. One more try. Say that for Stephen. Yeah. How do I indicate? Yeah. I have no answer.

[42:29]

Can somebody answer what I have to answer? Please put your answer for me. Did you hear that, Stephen? That's an obvious answer. Thank you.

[43:30]

I think that's why there are many, you know. There's always somebody who finds the answer. That's great. Thank you. Yeah, the two points, yeah. Desire and hate, maybe liking, disliking, yeah. I noticed that even though Jonah said no, he went to them.

[44:40]

And we can say no to our life sometimes if they prepare anything. Yeah. Yeah. So no is not very effective. Yeah. Yeah. and what i meant with that sometimes the truth will manifest anyway i had um one story came up that i was in a city which i didn't know in austria and i was supposed to go to the theater and actually to work and help at a certain time i was late and i wanted to stay on the main street because i knew The main street will lead to the theater, but it's an old city, and actually I knew that there would be, you know, abbreviations. There would be shorter ways to get to the theater. But I thought, no, we don't have time. Take the safe way. Stay on the main road so that you're not even more in time.

[45:47]

Yeah, more late. And something pushed me into a little road to the right. And I said to myself... no, stay on the main road, you don't have time to play around anymore, you know, stay on the main road. And it was that if something, whatever that was, the truth that had to manifest, pushed me into this little road, and I stood in front of a woman I knew, she was from that town, and she showed me the apparition to the theater, the place I had to go. And that's what I mean with, you know, the dance. And that something, if it has to happen and to manifest, it happens anyway. In spite of my no or yes, you know, we get pushed or, yeah. I think we have to close. Thank you very much.

[46:36]

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