This podcast is offered by the San Francisco Zen Center on the web at www.sfcc.org. Our public programs are made possible by donations from people like you. Good evening. Well, most of you who have heard me speak before... know that I came to practice after having discovered that I personally was going to die. It had not really, my personal mortality had not really come to my attention yet. I was 43 years old, you'd think you might have known, but suddenly my best friend was diagnosed with an inoperable brain tumor and died in a matter of weeks. And I had a very severe strep infection that became septic shock and almost died.

[01:04]

The Tibetans have a slogan or a teaching, death is certain. Time of death is uncertain. And when that became clear to me, the big question that came up in my mind was, How do you live if you know you're going to die? I don't know why I was so lucky as to have that question occur to me, but it was clear to me that if you knew you were going to die, that that should have an effect on how you live. In any event, in searching out that question, Someone told me about the Berklee Zendo, and I went there for Zazen instruction. And something about it was just a perfect fit. I started sitting daily from the time of my first Zazen instruction.

[02:11]

Quite fortunately, my husband, who was actually back east at the time, who'd been given by his friend a book called Three Pillars of Zen, read the instructions about sitting Sazen and started sitting Sazen back in Connecticut without me knowing that he was sitting and without him knowing that I was sitting. That kind of, I don't know, mysterious concordance was a wonderful thing in our lives. always had some difficulty trying to understand what the Buddha's teaching is on this question of rebirth. Because if there's no self, what is it that's reborn? And anyhow, it's been something I've been studying and wondering and...

[03:22]

trying to find some clarity about for the past 43 years. And Shohaku Okamura has quite a wonderful discussion on it in this book, Realizing Genjo Koan, that we're studying now. In his discussion of Section 8 of Genjo Koan, And therefore, I would like to, he has been studying Genjo Koan and Dogen Senji's writings for as long as I've been sitting. We both started sitting about the same time, only he was 17 and I was 43. What I would like to do tonight is read you his commentary and make a commentary.

[04:29]

Put my two cents in together with his. And some of you may know that my husband of 63 years died recently. And again, this question about rebirth comes up. For example, I chant, Every morning, a sutra to the bodhisattva of compassion for the well-being of people in the sangha who are sick or people whom I know who are sick. And also for, as I say, the calm crossing over and peaceful repose of those who have recently died. although I found that when I was just chanting for Lou, I was torn about calm crossing over in peaceful repose or many rebirths in which to continue your life as a bodhisattva vow.

[05:45]

And that's actually, when I'm chanting for him, That's what comes up for me is he was quite sincere in his bodhisattva vow to practice for the benefit of all beings until everyone... until there weren't any beings left who needed to be benefited by it. You know, I mean, he was... I went to a workshop once with a Tibetan teacher on dreams. He was very aware of his dreams and felt there was great significance in them. And in the course of driving down and back with him, somewhere in the conversation, Lu said something about himself, and Tartuku Rinpoche said,

[06:49]

Oh, that's because you were a monk in a previous life. Now, Lou was so focused on being a monk, not a teacher, not a scholar, a monk, not a priest, that that was another confusion. Well, maybe Maybe he just wants to go on having lives being a monk until the Bodhisattva vow is no longer necessary. I don't know. Anyhow, I really appreciate Shohaka-san's very careful treatment of it and would like to share that with you. So the section that he's... commenting on is, firewood becomes ash.

[07:52]

Ash cannot become firewood again. However, we should not view ash as after and firewood as before. We should know that firewood dwells in the Dharma position of firewood and has its own before and after. Although before and after exist, past and future are cut off. Ash stays in the position of ash with its own before and after. As firewood never becomes firewood again after it has burned ash, there is no return to living after a person dies. However, in Buddha Dharma, it is an unchanged tradition not to say that life becomes death. Therefore, we call it no arising. It is the established way of Buddha's turning the Dharma wheel, not to say that death becomes life. Therefore, we call it no perishing.

[08:56]

Life is a position in time. Death is also a position in time. This is like winter and spring. We don't think that winter becomes spring, and we don't say that spring becomes summer. So Shohakusan says, in the passage above, Dogen again discusses the no fixed self that he presents at the end of section seven. When he says, when we intimately practice and return right here, it is clear that all things have no fixed self. But now he considers it in terms of time. This no fixed self is the reality of life that includes arising and perishing, life and death, impermanence and lack of independent existence. In order to discuss this reality of no fixed self and arising and perishing, we must consider how things change within time.

[10:11]

We usually think of ourselves as being born, living and dying, within a stream of time that flows from past to present to future. But Dogen says that this is not the only way to view time. We will examine his views of time closely later, but first I would like to speak about the term life and death as it is used in this section. Life and death, you know, throughout what is teaching, this question of birth and death or life and death, is called the great matter. On the Han downstairs, which calls us to the Zendo, you know, we have this quotation that's often chanted every night in a monastery in Japan. Great is a matter of birth and death. All is impermanent, quickly passing. Wake up, wake up, each one. Don't waste this life.

[11:11]

There's a sense of urgency to understand about life and death. That's what Dogen Senji is speaking to. A common sort of parting words to someone who's leaving is to say, oh, daiji ni, please take care of the great matter. I mean, it's very central in Buddha's teaching. In the passage above, Dogen again discusses the no-fixed self that he presents in section seven. Okay. Life and Death is an English translation of the Japanese expression shoji. As a verb, the Japanese word sho, that is the character that's pronounced sho, means to live, ikiru, or to be born, umareru. and the second character means to die or to be dead.

[12:14]

Thus the expression can be translated into English as birth and death or life and death. Shoji is the process of life in which we are born, live, and die. As a Buddhist term, the Japanese word shoji is used as the equivalent of the Sanskrit words jatimarana and samsara. Jatimarana refers both to the process of being born, living and dying, and also to the four kinds of suffering or dukkha, that is birth, aging, sickness and death. In Buddhist philosophy, the process of birth and death is separated into two types. One type is the birth, life and death of ordinary living beings. that transmigrate within the six realms of the three worlds of desire, form and formlessness. These beings live being pulled by karma and their kind of life and death is called bundan shoji in Japanese or separating birth, life and death.

[13:27]

Another type of life and death refers to the practice of bodhisattvas that have been released from the karma produced by the three poisonous minds. The three poisonous minds are greed, hate, and delusion. Though they have been freed from transmigration, they keep returning to the three worlds in order to save beings from suffering. Life after life, they work diligently, eventually passing through each of the 52 bodhisattva stages that culminate in Buddhahood. Rather than karma, this process of life and death is moved by the bodhisattva vow and is referred to as henyaku shoji, which means transforming life and death. Ichigo shoji and Setsuna shoji are two other Buddhist terms that also refer to the process of being born, living and dying.

[14:29]

Ichigo shoji can be translated as life and death as one period. And this refers to the period of living between birth and death as we usually understand it. Setsuna Shoji means moment by moment life and death. Setsuna is a very brief increment of time, the merest fraction of a second. And Setsuna Shoji refers to the process of the body and mind arising and perishing over and over again, moment by moment. Shoji is also used as a translation of the Sanskrit word samsara. Samsara, you will recall, refers to the cycle of suffering in which beings transmigrate through the six realms of hell, hungry ghosts, animals, assurers, human beings, and heavenly beings. It is important to remember...

[15:32]

that the common Buddhist usage of life and death refers to the cycle of samsara, the opposite of nirvana. When Dogen says in Shobo Genzo, shoji, life and death, that, quote, life and death is Buddha's life, he means our life in samsara is nothing other than nirvana. Unless we understand this point, we cannot fully appreciate the power of Dogen's words. The two above meanings of shoji are often used interchangeably, since the process of birth, living, and dying is actually part of the process of transmigration within samsara. But in this section of Genjo Koan, Dogen specifically uses the expression shoji in referring to the process of arising, dwelling, and perishing that applies to all sentient and insentient beings.

[16:35]

As part of this process, each person is born at a certain time in the past. In my case, I was born on June 22, 1948. At that time, my body was tiny. But since then, my body and mind have been constantly Changing. The baby shohaku became a boy. The boy became a teenager. The teenager became a young adult, and the young adult became the middle-aged person I am now. If I'm lucky, the middle-aged person will become an old person. But if that is so, the old person will eventually die and disappear. From birth until death, we are constantly changing. An existing variation. experiencing variations in our conditions. Yet in our common way of thinking, we say that over 60 years ago, shohaku was that little baby, and years from now, this middle-aged person will be the same shohaku.

[17:43]

Over 30 years ago, I was a young, newly ordained monk with lots of energy and many problems, but now my energy is decreasing and my problems are very different. When I was 20, I never imagined that I would one day live in the United States and speak English. Since coming to the United States, I've been much influenced by American culture, so I think differently than before I came. But we commonly understand that I was the same person when I was a baby, when I was a teenager, when I was in my 20s, 30s, 40s, and 50s. Most of us believe this, but is it really true? If we imagine it is somehow true that one remains the same person throughout time, then we must posit something within us that remains unchanged through the process of change. This entity, which is not the baby, teenager, young man, middle-aged man, or older man, changes only in outer appearance with the flow of time.

[18:50]

According to this view, only the appearance of the body and mind change. like articles of clothing we wear on different occasions. Although a person's appearance changes, she keeps essentially the same body and mind from birth to death. This is an idea that people in India believed at the time of the Buddha. The unchanging inner entity was called Atman, and it was believed to transmigrate through many different conditions, being pulled by good and bad karma. They believed that although Atman is pure, it is imprisoned in a body that is impure and is therefore the source of delusive desires. According to Atman theory, the changing body and mind are like a car. And Atman is like the owner and operator of the car. Abhidharma Kosha, written by the famous Indian Buddhist philosopher Vasubandhu,

[19:54]

contains the most clear and precise definition of Atman I have found. In the process of refuting the existence of Atman, Vasubandhu defines it as a single, permanent owner-operator of what we call the body and mind, the union of the five aggregates. This owner, or Atman, of the car, the five aggregates, keeps and drives the car as long as it keeps running, but when the car wears out, the owner gives it up and buys a new one. According to this theory, when the body and mind die, the owner, Atman, leaves and is born into a new body and mind. This is the basic idea of the transmigration of the Atman, a process that happens over and over, life after life. In the Buddha's day... Conventional Indian ideology taught that a person is reborn into one of the six realms of samsara, depending upon whether the individual generates good or bad karma during his or her lifetime.

[21:04]

If the person accumulates good karma through good actions, the person will be born with the body and mind of a heavenly being, living in favorable circumstances. If the person accumulates bad karma through bad actions, the person is born into difficult circumstances with an inferior body and mind, for example. This theory of karma was widely believed in Indian society at the time of the Buddha, and the Atman theory existed as one interpretation of the more general belief in karmic transmigration. The Buddha's teaching on this subject was called an-atman or no-atman, no soul, no essential existence or no self. He opposed the basic idea of atman as a permanent entity that transmigrates in samsara. The Buddha taught that the world is comprised solely of the five aggregates, form, sensations, perception, mental formations and consciousness.

[22:17]

that are themselves neither substantial nor permanent. He taught that these aggregates are the sole constituents of the human body and mind, and that there is no separate permanent owner-operator that is the essence of a human being. The Buddha said that only the five aggregates exist, nothing else. You know, when we chant the Heart Susha, we say, no eyes, no ears, no nose, no tongue, no body, no mind, no sight, no sound, no smell, no taste, no touch, no object of mind, no birth, anyhow, no birth, no death. None of it, right? The Buddha negated the theory of Atman, but he did not negate the belief in the transmigration, since it was the basis of Indian social morality during his time. But if nothing but the five aggregates exist, what is it that transmigrates?

[23:23]

This is a very natural question. The Buddha emphasized the principle of causality, the teaching of cause and result. This teaching says that a person's negative actions cause painful effects, while positive actions create pleasurable effects. But if there is no Atman, Who is it that performs the action and who is it that receives the results? The Buddha said that the self must receive the result of its own karmic actions. We might be moved to ask then, what is this self if it is not Atman? Indeed, this is a common question asked about the Buddha's teachings. And though many Buddhist philosophers have tried to answer this question logically, No one has been able to provide an adequate answer. Yet to this day, almost all Buddhist traditions teach both the theory of anatman and the belief in transmigration.

[24:28]

Well, this is... I've spent a lot of time with this question. How many of you have had this question arise? I think it's very common. It's sort of inevitable. given the Buddha's teaching. So now we come back to Dogen Sekchi. Dogen and no-self. In Bendawa, the talk on the wholehearted practice of the way, and other chapters of Shobo Genso, such as Sokushin Zebutsu, Mind... itself is Buddha, and Bhusho, Buddha nature, Dogen clearly negates the theory of Atma. In his response to question 10 in Bendo Wa, for example, Dogen writes, the idea that you have just mentioned is not Buddha Dharma at all, but the fallacious view of Seneca.

[25:36]

This fallacy says that there is a spiritual intelligence in one's body which discriminates love and hatred or right and wrong as soon as it encounters phenomena and has the capacity to distinguish all such things as pain and itching or suffering and pleasure. Furthermore, when this body perishes, the spirit nature escapes and is born elsewhere. Therefore, although it seems to expire here, Since the spirit nature is born elsewhere, it is said to be permanent, never perishing. Such is this fallacious doctrine. However, to learn this theory and suppose it is Buddha Dharma is more stupid than grasping a tile or a pebble and thinking it is a golden treasure. Nothing can compare to the shamefulness of this idiocy. National teacher...

[26:40]

Ei Chu Huizhong of Dong China strictly admonished against this mistake. So now isn't it ridiculous to consider that the erroneous view of mind being permanent and material form being impermanent is the same as the wondrous dharma of the Buddhas and to think that you become free from life and death when actually you are arousing the fundamental cause of life and death? This indeed is most pitiful. Just realize that this is a mistaken view. You should give no ear to it. End of quote. Some people living in Dogen's time thought the mind was permanent and the body impermanent. The mind was considered to be like the pure permanent Atman and the body was considered to be impure and the source of delusive desire. These people called the mind Shinsho or mind nature and and they called the body Shinso, or bodily form.

[27:45]

This mind nature was often used as a synonym for Buddha nature, and this misunderstanding of the Buddha's teaching prompted Dogen's negation of the idea of Kensho, or seeing the nature. Kensho is a term often used in the Rinzai Zen tradition, where it refers to an enlightenment experience itself that usually happens as a result of koan practice. Zen masters began using this expression in China's Dong Dynasty. The term appears many times, for example, in the Platform Sutra of the Sixth Ancestor, Wei Neng. Dogen, however, did not like this word. In Shobo Genzo, Shi Zen Biku, the Bixu... the essence of the Buddha Dharma. The Buddha, in the fourth jhana, he writes, the essence of the Buddha Dharma is never seeing the nature can show.

[28:57]

Which of the 28 ancestors of India and the seven Buddhas in the past said that the Buddha Dharma is simply seeing the nature. Although the term seeing the nature can show appears in the Platform Sutra of the Sixth Ancestor, that text is a forgery. It is not the writing of a person who received the transmission of the Dharma at Treasury. It is not Kausi's words. And descendants of the Buddhas and ancestors never trust and use this text at all. And yet I am quite sure, based on my studies, that Dogen did believe in the henyaku shoji, transforming life and death of the bodhisattvas, and Shobogenzo's Sanji Go, karma in the three times, and Jinshin Inga, deeply believing in cause and result, for example.

[29:58]

Dogen emphasizes having faith in the principle of cause and result beyond the present lifetime. And in Shobogenzo Doshin, Weimind, Dogen encourages us to chant, I take refuge in the Buddha, life after life until reaching Buddhahood. He also instructs us in Doshin to ceaselessly chant, I take refuge in the Buddha, the Dharma, and the Sangha. During Chu, the usually 49-day intermediate period that according to classical Buddhist teaching exists between the end of life and rebirth into the next. As you can see, Dogen's teaching of no self and his view of rebirth seem to contradict each other. If there is no permanent self or atman and our bodies and minds are transitory, what entity is it that can chant, I take refuge in Buddha after death? In any case, if this is a contradiction, Buddhism has always held it.

[31:06]

People often ask me, what is the Soto Zen view of rebirth? This is a difficult question because Dogen Zenji, I believe, advocates not knowing in this case. Rather than offering us a consistent view on rebirth, He teaches that we should let go of our limiting concepts and beliefs and simply practice right here, right now. When we do so, we naturally and responsibly care for the future of our practice in the present. So this is what I'm appreciating very much is how to work, how to really appreciate our practice. and have confidence in our practice, even though there is this apparent contradiction throughout Buddhism, actually, as far as I can tell.

[32:10]

Dogen teaches that we should let go of our limiting concepts and beliefs and simply practice right here, right now. When we do so, we naturally and responsibly care for the future as our practice in the present. I also believe that this is the reason Shakyamuni Buddha did not deny transmigration, although he refuted the existence of the Atman. His teaching on Atman shows us that the truth of emptiness applies even to our own bodies and minds, allowing us freedom from the reification of ourselves and our views, while cause and effect as the underlying principle for transmigration illustrates that we must nonetheless take responsibility for our activities of body, speech, and mind. That the Buddha offered both of these seemingly contradictory teachings indicates, I think,

[33:20]

that we must embrace the principles supporting both while attaching to neither. Personally, I don't believe in literal rebirth, yet I don't deny its existence either. I have no basis for either believing in or denying literal rebirth. The only thing I can say about it with sure it is, I don't know. For me, the important point is to practice in this lifetime as the Buddha taught in the Dhammapada. That is, refrain from anything bad and practice everything good. Purify your mind. This is the teaching of the seven Buddhas. This is the, in our own tradition, this is the three pure precepts. Avoid evil, do good, benefit needs. And this for me is the answer to my question of how do you live if you know you're going to die?

[34:27]

And that I'm very happy to have an answer to. Just take the bodhisattva vow and live a life of vow. If rebirth exists, that's all right. I will simply try to continue practicing everything good and refrain from everything bad through my next life. If there is no rebirth, I will have nothing to do after the death and I will have no need to consider my practice. This was my view of rebirth for most of my life as a Buddhist. When I turned 50, however, I began to think about rebirth differently. And I wish to speak about that briefly because I believe it may illustrate a key reason for the development of the Bodhisattva's Henyaku Shoji, transforming life and death, as a principle of Mahayana Buddhism.

[35:32]

As I enter the latter period of my life, I now find that I do hope I will live another life after this one, since this life has been too short to do all I need to do in practicing the Buddha way. For example, for many years I have been working on the translation of Zen Buddhist texts from Japanese to English. Yet I know that my life will be too short to even fully understand the true deep meaning of the teachings of Shakyamuni Buddha, Dogen and other great teachers, let alone translate them into English. So I actually do hope to be reborn as a Buddhist so I can continue the work I'm now doing. I think this wish has risen because the aging process has shown me my limitations and I suspect that the Mahayana belief in the Bodhisattvas, Henyaku Shoji, originated in this type of awakening to the limitations of individual life.

[36:41]

So I was very happy to read this because what I had come up with is the same thing that he came up with. When people bring up this question to me, I've always said, I'm afraid I'm an agnostic about rebirth. I don't know. Which I think is the literal meaning of agnostics. not knowing. And which is why I think, and for the same reason that he brings up, why I went from saying calm crossing over in peaceful repose to wishing for Lou when I chant for him. continual rebirth to practice his bodhisattva vow.

[37:56]

Until there's no need for the bodhisattva vow. Whatever that might be. Until everyone is already crossed over, then I can join them. There is more discussion here of the firewood and ash, life, death, and time, but I don't think there's time for it tonight. But I think you will appreciate why I wanted to share, I hope you will appreciate why I wanted to share Shohaku's careful, and thoroughgoing investigation of this question, because I think it's a question we all have, those of us who practice. Am I right?

[39:00]

Does this question concern you as you practice? And I just think he has, Buddha Dharma said this book was masterful. I think I would, join them in that assessment. I think he has really brought some clarity to this question for me and I hope for you. And I would recommend the whole book. I find it very, very helpful in supporting my practice. and in giving me more confidence that I'm not barking up the wrong tree. And this question of how to live our life, I mean, this precious life that's been given to us, the question of how to live it is really important.

[40:06]

And I think that's all this study is about, is to help us find the most... beneficial way to live this incredible gift of life that we've been given. And for me, at this point, I'm even more convinced that the way we live, the way we actually live our life is the really important part of the Buddha Dharma. both the study and practice of the Buddha Dharma, is to find out how to live this life that's been given to us in the most beneficial way. Sorry. I think it's all right if we go to bed.

[41:11]

Have you said a reasonable hour, don't you? Thank you for listening to this podcast offered by the San Francisco Zen Center. Our Dharma talks are offered at no cost and this is made possible by the donations we receive. Your financial support helps us to continue to offer the Dharma. For more information, visit sfcc.org and click Giving. May we fully enjoy the Dharma.

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