Good morning. Wave your hands if you can hear me. From this end, this all feels a little abstract. This is the first time we've done this. We're not quite sure what's going on. Usually we rehearse things endlessly and then do it. This time it's ad lit, which is kind of fun and a little confused.

[13:26]

give you a scan of this room. You can see we're in the Tassajara Zendo. During the practice period, we spend most of our waking hours. And now, For the first time ever, we have brought broadcasting capacities into the Zen. Who knows what this means for the future? So here at Tassahara, in a way we have been sheltering in place since early January.

[14:32]

So when the order came to shelter in place, we were well rehearsed and capable of following those instructions. And yet, at the same time, that order totally disrupted our way of doing it. The monastic order of the ango, the practice period here at Tassara, it emphasizes togetherness. We sit together, we eat our meals formally together, we work together. When the bell rings, we even go to bed in our own separate quarters. at the same time and get up at the same time. So this sheltering in place created for us a new normal.

[15:38]

We had to pick apart a thousand year old tradition and try to capture the essence of it and bring it into a new set of circumstances. So that's part of how I'd like to address you in this topic. But what I'd like to do is I'd like to start with the poem that I started to practice for it with. The poem's called, We Look With Uncertainty, by a poet named Anthony. And I was thinking, when I was thinking of reading this poem, I was thinking, yes, but the uncertainty that we had in mind then is not the uncertainty that's facing us now, or maybe it is. We look with uncertainty beyond the old choices for clear-cut answers to a softer, more permeable alight, which is every moment at the blink of death.

[16:48]

When we were thinking of this uncertainty, one way to describe it would be we were thinking about that existential uncertainty. That life keeps changing. Life is unpredictable. And we're in that web of existence together. We're part of it. We can't separate from it. challenge for us is how do we relate to them? As I was reflecting on that, I was thinking of this curious daily dialogue that happens around the COVID-19 virus. I was thinking of the daily news

[17:59]

by President Trump and Dr. Anthony Fauci. Speaking of President Trump, seemingly unreserved, flamboyant, free associations as he presents whatever it is he presents. I mean, I have never seen any of it live. I read about it. And then Dr. Antonio Fanchi, this model of uprightness, this model of deliberate, intentional response. I read somewhere that he said, He will say what is true and whatever happens, happens.

[19:07]

And he carries that forth right after the president has spoken. And often says something quite different on a factual level from the president. But when asked, Is he contradicting the president? He says, I say what's true for me. I say what I have gleaned from 40 years of epidemiology and studying the facts and statistics that are presented on a daily basis. One way I think that his non-violent speech is extraordinary. I think he's the Dalai Lama of epidemiology, reported with such an upright character.

[20:21]

And apparently he has a long history in this regard. He was in the position he's in running a very large government agency on epidemiology when the AIDS epidemic struck. He was in the foreground of creating a response to that. And now he's in the foreground of creating a response to COVID-19 virus. But I was also thinking Don't we all have something of what the president has within? Aren't we all prone to take a variety of pieces of information and to examine them in the context of yourself? Aren't we all a little prone to the contagion

[21:28]

of the fears, anxieties, sadnesses, grief that arise in relationship to this virus. And then don't we weave a narrative from it with the same extemporaneous flamboyance Although, usually most of us do it in the practice of our own living room. We don't do it in front of 20 million people. But still, there is a notion in Zen following a statement by Yanmin, where he said, the medicine and the disease arise together. But this curious combination between getting caught up in our fears and anxieties and sadnesses and grief around all of this.

[22:46]

And let's face it happens on a level that's hard to comprehend. We have never experienced something transform our world. in a matter of weeks, it seemingly has touched almost every country, if not every country. This is a new event. Here we are in the throes of it. How will it spread? What will it create? Will it turn out to be overestimated, the mortality rate will be less, that in a few months we'll be able to resume a more usual way of being. It will turn out that it will be a turning stone, a turning point in our life, that our society will change.

[23:59]

And how will we internally relate to it? Will this help us face, each one of us face our emotional life in a more thorough and honest way? Will we after this be able to admit to ourselves the ways we feel lonely? the ways we yearn for the comfort of others, the ways in which we prefer to know, we prefer to have some sense of control. I read an article recently and it said there's two kinds of uncertainty. The first kind of uncertainty is epistemological. what we know.

[25:07]

Maybe Dr. Fauci could expound a little on his, I say what I know. I say what I know given the limited information we have. When do we not have limited information about our own lives, about who we are, about the conditions of existence that we're facing. And yet, in the middle of that, we put together a version of reality. And then the other kind of uncertainty is called agliatori. If you haven't heard of that before, neither did I until four days ago. It means the randomness of our existence. Even if to the best of our ability, we behave in the appropriate manner, do all the right things, eat the right amount of vegetables and fruit, get the right level of exercise, meditate, do yoga, all those wonderful things.

[26:28]

Still, we are subject. to causes and conditions that can radically change our life in moments. And Anne Hildenman says, we look with uncertainty. And that uncertainty opens a doorway for us. And does that instruct us? Does that challenge us in the way that we grow? Does that draw us closer? I mean, how amazing to think that so many people in the world, from the United States to India, you know, from Japan,

[27:32]

in Brazil, many countries in the world, the people of how many countries in the world are sheltering in place. And then our world has shrunk that much. Will it make a deep imprint of us? Or at some point, will we side with relief? maybe when a vaccine has been created and we can all return to so-called normal, individual, separate, predictable, controllable existence. And this wonderful coin of young, the difficulties and the liberation

[28:35]

this is and the medicine they arise together how does that happen so here at tassahara we decided as we've learned over the years to have a ceremony, to end something, to end our strict schedule, thousand-year-old schedule that dictates each part of our debt. We decided to have a ceremony and allow ourselves to acknowledge, experience, what it is to draw something to a place, something that's coming to an end.

[29:42]

Not when we had planned, not because we prefer it that way, but because circumstances dictated. The uncertainty of impermanence has spoken. And so we do. We held our zen. We held up this moment as appropriate and in its own way as sacred and momentous. And then we set about creating what is going to come next. At first, of information around the characteristics of the virus and provided us with a little information and then a little more and then a little more.

[30:51]

And then what we did was what we have learned from sitting, eating, working together day after day. We communicated with each other. This is what we know. We tried to follow the white court, knowing it, the dictate of Dr. Fauci. This is what we know and we accept whatever happens, happens. And out of that, we started to put together a new world. new way of being in this beautiful valley the tasaharism we asked ourselves in the spirit of zen what's appropriate response what is it now that is appropriate in dealing with what we're doing

[32:06]

And we had meetings, appropriately socially distanced, to hear each other's words. And not just content of each other's words, but also the heart and the sensibilities of each other's being. even the second time we did it, something extraordinary happened. The listening to each other felt like a sacred act. For those very reasons that I just mentioned, not so much that the content of what we said was so extraordinary or exquisite, But the depth of fear, the heartfulness, the thoughtfulness, the wisdom, the acceptance with which each person spoke fortified us all.

[33:34]

And after that leaving, Certainly for me and others totally, it was for them too. It felt like whatever happens, happens and we will face it. We will relate to it. We will adapt to it. And we will continue to practice. And we will create a practice environment. To me, This is medicine and disease treating each other. The young man goes on and he says, the whole world is medicine. Every detail of this is a clarion call to wake up.

[34:40]

whether it's external, the latest statistics on how many people have the virus, how many people have died. And for those of us who now have experienced coming closer to home, someone we knew, maybe a family member, seriously ill, or has died. And even though of us who haven't experienced that, knowing that it's an imminent possibility. There's no guarantee. So as we took up those formidable definitions of our new normal, We listen deeply to the impact of that.

[35:50]

And all this, I would say, how I'm describing how we hear it as Haru responded, I think this is the challenge and the opportunity for each of us. Can we listen to ourselves? Can we attend to and acknowledge our moments of vulnerability, our moments of sense of loss. I remember the moment when I thought, okay, the practice period ends on this day, and then on this day I'm going to do this, and on this day I'm going to... So, thinking of my calendar for the next couple of months. And then realizing, none of that is going to happen. It's a different world. I will not fly off to that place and hold it in.

[37:01]

I will not be at city center on the 18th of April, sitting in the Buddha hall in a very familiar setting. Of course, I had no idea I'd be sitting here talking to my computer, which isn't that responsible. And somehow I feel obliged to stare straight at it. Looking at it. a little blank square that says iPad. So this medicine and disease subduing each other. How to internalize it, how to start to see and acknowledge and hold us sacred.

[38:17]

What exactly is happening now, internally? And what is it to relate to it? As Anne Hilden in her poem says, a softer, more carnival enlightenment. I think sometimes we can think the practice will make us maybe less permeable, but we'll be able to withstand the uncertainties of life, the hazards, the difficulties, and the heartbreaks of life. And then to discover that's not the request of practice.

[39:25]

The request of practice is to soak up this stuff of love, to hold it tenderly and sacredly, to listen deeply to it. that it registers so fully that it teaches us something that we can't figure out. And it teaches us in ways beyond words and ideas. It is Anne Hillman goes on and says, on the brink of death. Maybe the brink of death of normal, but also the brink of what's next, the brink of possibility of new creation.

[40:33]

And here the challenge for us is, in the midst of these challenges, in the midst of these difficulties that we'll, in our humanness, stare up our vulnerable emotions, our difficult emotions. In the midst of that, how do we find the fortitude and the courage and the straightforwardness to persevere the way Antonio Fauci does? I was wondering Is what we're seeing now the product of his 30 years of handling the AIDS epidemic? Has medicine and disease made him this person who could stand there?

[41:39]

And honestly declare, we don't know yet. We don't know yet. the percentage of people who are asymptomatic, who have already contracted the bodies. We don't know. Maybe it's 10, maybe it's 50%. That's my truth. How does each of us hold our truth in that way? picture just popped up called Rasta's wonderful little girl sitting on her father's I assume well so so how do we create that trust and and I think the challenge I mean if we look at it with our thinking mind the challenge is to see

[42:51]

how unusual patterns of creating predictability and control are not effective. They never have. In the teachings of the Dharma of Buddhism, we say the three marks of existence are impermanence, no separate, independent existence, and then the third one is intriguing. Usually it's translated as dukkha, suffering. But Thich Nhat Hanh translates it as nirvana, the end of suffering. This grind of bringing forth the deeper truth, this grind of being, highly related to being and what helps to define that as either a medicine or a disease. How it's related to can enhance the disease, the discomfort, the discontent, or it can draw us closer to a state of being that's open and available

[44:20]

to whatever happens. It's not created upon certain prerequisites. So how do we do that? So Buddhism, we teach two ways. That we find moments, we find ways in our life We find moments, we find ways in our life to give preference to being present, to being upright, to letting something soften and open, find its depth and its stability. And in the Zen school, we call that Zaza.

[45:25]

sometimes arising through cross-legged sitting, sometimes listening and feeling deeply the words of others, as we did that night when we had our community meeting. But then how do we carry that state of being into the vicissitudes of being a human being, singularly and collectively, looking for each one of us, looking at and honestly acknowledging how we get stuck, how we get pulled back into negative thinking or emotion. how we struggle to create something that operates according to our own preferences.

[46:39]

And that looking deeply, that holding it as sacred, and listening and learning from it, individually and collectively, that's what helps to build the ground of trust. We trust the process, and it's not contingent on knowing the outcome. And in the Zen school, this is the basis of appropriate response. This is how the whole world becomes medicine. A young man finishes his call in this school, he says, Medicine and disease create each other. The whole world is medicine. What is the self? What is this way of being that can trip us up, that can cause more problems for ourselves and our relationships and our sense of purpose and well-being?

[48:03]

What is it to liberate? What is it to discover the courage, the honesty, the humility, the steadfastness of meeting our life as it appears? And so here's Anne Hildman's poem. We look with uncertainty beyond the old choices for clear-cut answers to a softer, more permeable aliveness. which is every moment at the blink of death. For something new is being born in us, if we were glad. We stand at a new doorway, awaiting that which comes, daring to be human creatures, vulnerable to the beauty of existence. When what? Before I end the talk and open it up to questions, I would like to read you a poem that is the collective works of the Sangha here at Kassar.

[49:35]

Yesterday, I asked the Sangha if they would be interested in joining in this collective writing. And I asked them if they would start with these words. What I want you to know. There's a way in which we can ask something of ourselves. Whether we say, What's happening? What's going on? What's appropriate response? And of course, all we're really asking is, how is it appearing for me right now? If I attend to it as thoroughly as I can, what can I say?

[50:44]

but I want you to know. That was the opening question. And then when we have that kind of intentionality, that way of engaging, it's as if we're acknowledging that which we could almost say within us knows. but we have been living this life and this life has been teaching us. That usually we're more caught up in the consequences of our thinking and the realities it proposes, what we like and don't like about them. And not so attentive to what's being deeply done. So, This phrase, what I want you to know is attending to that people way of being and what we've left.

[51:56]

And often as we explore it, it's a surprise to ourselves. And sometimes it takes a patience to let it rise up into words or ideas or images. So here's the poem. Unfortunately, fortunately, many people in the sangha here took up this challenge. What follows for you from the phrase, what I want you to know? And I made a quick effort this morning to turn them into a poem. And I think I've used like 10% of what was written. And most of what was written was utterly extraordinary. Maybe we'll post it all about.

[52:57]

Who knows? But I want you to know. Six feet apart. Closer than ever. Endowed. By four billion years of evolution, the human body is enough. You are enough. We are enough. Wherever you are right now, make it a temple filled with compassion. Listen to what wants to be known. Like you, precious and worthy of life. Keep flowing, the hiking trails of sprouted grass and wildflowers, turning this angle inside out. Constant and always changing. Now is all we have.

[54:02]

Moment by moment, appropriate response. So now we'll have a Q&A, I think. Maybe Kodo, you could give me some clues as to what to do. Sure. Thank you, Yushin. If anyone would like to ask a question, oh, it seems... Kodo, and then just let me know. Oh, sure. Can you hear me now? Maybe no? Doesn't look like Ryushin can hear me. I can't hear you. Oh, no, no. In the chat. Let me see if my computer may be turned off. Sorry, my computer may be turned off. Great. Can you hear me now?

[55:04]

Thanks. Great. So thank you very much. It looks like some people have the idea already. If you'd like to ask a question, You can open your participants window by hovering over the bottom of your Zoom window. Touch this Manage Participants button, and then a box should appear at the bottom of which you should see an option to raise your hand. I see a few... Can I do a hover over? One more time? What do I need to hover over? Oh, for you, I can... Okay, three participants raise your hand. I got it. Great. So I can unmute folks, and then we can have a little Q&A. And... So Koda, I'm still not clear what's next.

[56:08]

Oh, sure. Let's start with Della. Paul-san, good morning. Good morning. Two questions. One is, how are you? And the other question is, disease and medicine arise together. What diseases are we creating from the medicines we're offering right now? First of all, I'm fine. And even though I had to abandon my scheduled events, it's turned out to be a marvelous gift of seeing

[57:18]

Springtime at Tassahara. And being in community in a way, usually we order ourselves so thoroughly that spaciousness and doing nothing seems elusive. Now we're treating ourselves, I think, a little better and enjoying it. What disease? The disease that comes with not realizing the nature of what is and trying to make it something other than what it is. And maybe

[58:20]

in regards to the virus and all the anxieties and distress it has produced, mainly trying to not accept that it challenges our vulnerabilities and our sense of security and predictability and control. And I think, I feel particularly blessed being here and certainly hope that everyone can find their sangha, their place where they can listen deeply and talk from a deep place and have others listen. I think this is the opportunity of our time. I mean, I have noticed, I have received more messages from friends who were just asking, are you okay?

[59:28]

And it's been delightful. Usually we're all so busy doing the wonderful things that we do. It's such simple messages, we don't send them. Now it's different. The medicine has come to meet the disease. And I hope you're finding a less busy schedule too. Thank you. Just a clarification. I was, you know, I have this feeling that our reaction to this COVID and everything that we are doing, if we call that as quote unquote medicine, I keep wondering what new diseases this medicine is creating.

[60:33]

Well, in some ways we don't know, do we? what new diseases it's creating. And then in some ways we do. We have the Dharma of thousands of years, the collective wisdom of our humanity that teaches us here's how we create problems for ourselves. That old age and sickness and death are always present and that they are our teachers. It's not for nothing that they're sometimes described as the heavenly messengers. And they will remind us what's important. Thank you. Tim Wicks.

[61:43]

Hi. Paul, thank you so much. This was wonderful. This historic event. And to be in the Zendo right there. And we can actually hear the Tassajara birds. And even though we're at a distance and going through technology, I'm still emotionally having the same response that I do when I'm sitting in that room with you. So thank you all, everyone who put this together. My question is, the appropriate response is a concept that we put into practice in Zen. Can you tell me, in 30 words or less, what the relationship between the concept of justice and the appropriate response is in our Zen practice? So this is a general question.

[62:47]

Thank you. The concept of justice in our Zen practice. No, I think in a way, when we look at the books on law and we look at the phrase jurisprudence, there is a humility to it. It's not saying this is an absolute. It's saying, This is an important thing for us to attend to. And as we attend to it and arrive at conclusions, we should always hold those conclusions in the context of that we're continually learning. So that justice is the product of our collective learning. What has our experience regarding this particular topic or issue.

[63:47]

What has our collective experience taught us as to what's appropriate and fair? And that's why often in law, you'll see lawyers citing different cases. Here's how we dealt with it in the past. Here's what the situation was that's common to the one we're dealing with. And here's what we come up with. Not to say that's the answer, but to say, let's be informed. Let's learn from our experience and apply it. And then I would also say, Tim, that kindness, compassion, honesty, patience, you know, all the paramitas and the paramis, they always are there. They always apply. Even when we have to draw boundaries, do we draw boundaries and limitations? with a deep compassion for the impact of what we're doing or really draw the boundaries with the sense of entitlement or even aggression towards those who are going to have to live with the consequences i mean i think that is woven into justice you know especially from the point of view of the dharma but the type that those attributes

[65:14]

Legality becomes a dry mechanism. It sometimes produces injustice. Very good. Thank you. Next, Joseph. I can't see Joseph. Can you hear me? I hear Joe now. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Let's see if I can get on the screen. Yeah. I'm here in Bangkok. You're still in Bangkok. Still living here.

[66:18]

Not far from where you ordained as a month. And so I'm just much safer here. than it is in the united states and uh you know we're under lockdown but it's not nearly as bad as it is in california or certainly not new york the feeling that i have that i want to ask about is i'm about 10 000 miles away from most of the people that i care about the most that i love the most most of my family most of my friends are in new york and San Francisco. And so I have a feeling of sort of helplessness that, you know, part of me is happy that I'm here and safe. And part of me feels like, oh, I can't help the people in New York or California that I'm closest to.

[67:19]

And so how would I deal with these feelings? one thing we've learned here joe is that um physical distance and social intimacy or social closeness um are not contradictory you know that i think quite literally we carry people in our art and and that that's um That's its own kind of closeness and connection. But I also think that, like just to see your face on the screen, you know, is evocative. You know, I think of you and I sitting in Rimtan at city center, discussing the Dharma. I think of meeting you in Bangkok, discovering there you were, creating a kind of

[68:25]

returning the Dharma to one of its root sources and running your own group. I mean, all those things flood back just from a visual. And that smile. I think in some ways it's that simple. that we can connect. I think it's a deep aspect of our human existence to connect. And I do think it nourishes us. And it's my hope that going through this pandemic and this, what we, I would say, misnaming social isolation, or social distancing, I think we're right to be discovering that it can be physically distancing, but the gift of it is to grow socially closer.

[69:41]

When I put out that prompt for the poems, I was amazed at how many people responded and wrote such extraordinary statements as they did. That we're all, as you know, only too well from your own poetry, that we're all endeavoring to put voice and word to the human experience, which as you and I both know is nothing but one long poem. It's the one long poem of humanity. Yeah. Each one of us as a voice. Yeah.

[70:43]

Lovely to see you. I hope you're doing well. Yeah, I'm fine. It's good to see you well. Yes. Take care. You too. Chris Burnham. Thank you very much for doing this. I'm also really enjoying hearing the birds of Tassajara. I miss it. So it was kind of difficult to focus on the talk for a few reasons. So if I'm asking you something that you already said, I want to apologize in advance. I don't think you really... Basically, you mentioned Thich Nhat Hanh's translation of Dukkha as Nirvana. And I was wondering if you had any thoughts about... It was his translation of one of the three marks of existence.

[71:55]

And was the mark he translated dukkha or was it one of the other ones? That's a more common translation of it. The more common translation of that mark of existence is dukkha. And he translates it as nirvana because it's like the difference is like saying, well, the common human way to respond to existence creates dukkha. And he's saying the capacity in responding to existence can open the gate of liberation and create the capacity is there to do that. The opportunity is there to do that. So I guess what's the original or sort of more root mark of existence that gets translated in these two seemingly contradictory ways? codependent arising of each moment.

[73:06]

That would be the root of the characteristic. And then that can either create dukkha or that can create nirvana, dependent on how it's related to. And we could say that early Buddhism is saying, well, this is what we're inclined to do, so that's where we begin. You begin with where you're at. And we're inclined to create dukkha, so start there. And notice that. Because we can look at what's my response to this COVID-19 virus and all the uncertainty and restrictions it creates you know what what what do i tend to do and then as i look at it what do i learn from it how do i turn that learning into action and how do i realize and enact the path of liberation so if i had had a more straightforward mind i probably would have said that in the talk

[74:38]

but somehow my mind works in poetic images. Most of us are infused by our emotional life. So the mark of existence maybe could be thought of as a opportunity or potential to respond. Yes. Okay. And that's... You're welcome. We're in Cleveland. Hello, Paul. Hello. Nice to see you. Good to see you, too. Yeah, thank you so much for your talk. Yeah, it's so precious to be able to hear you and the Chelsea Harpers and the Den Show and to see the Zendo as we're all in our own little rooms.

[75:40]

I have this question. For me, it feels like this time has been this call to really learn how to face the moment, to see, yeah, to see, like, on the one hand, you know, I'm fairly privileged in that, for me, this means that I have shelter for the time being, I have some food, and I have actually a lot of time to practice. I felt like this governmentally sponsored sushine, which I'm very grateful for, with so many teachers offering their practices and their teachings online. And feeling the real gift of that, feeling just the kind of abundant generosity of everyone in the community and the practice. And then also feeling the real tragedy, like feeling the sense that there's on the global scale in countries that are much less... financially resourced than we are, there are just unimaginable tragedies or tragedies that are occurring in nursing homes or in detention centers or in prisons.

[76:49]

And this kind of this dual sense of the good that's coming through in this moment. And also, yeah, just the tragedy, how many selfish actions have resulted in horrific consequences for So many people are, you know, being motivated by ignorance or by greed or by hatred. And really, yeah, I guess I just feel a strong call to be able to hold it, to be able to see and contain that whole spectrum. And it's difficult. I feel myself kind of, you know, asking. So I wonder, would you speak to that? Um... So this is what I've been trying to delineate for us, that both of these are mixed together. And each of us in our own way, I think, would like to have the positive aspects blossom and have the negative aspects be remedied and go away.

[78:06]

But seemingly it's not the nature of our world. As Dr. Fauci says, what happens, happens. We have this limited amount of information. We have this limited agency. And that's the world in which we live. We can say, oh, this connects to our global... geopolitical systems this connects to our global commerce and ecology yes it does and this this connects to the human tendency to want to accumulate wealth at the expense of the well-being of others yes it does and can we um can this occasion instruct us Okay, going forward, what have I learned?

[79:09]

What have we learned? Is it possible that we, as citizens of this earth, could think that way? Can this pandemic teach us? We are all in this together. We all breathe the same air. This virus, affects every single one of us the same way. Can we learn? Can we truly have a World Health Organization that helps the whole world? Can we truly have United Nations where we meet to discuss our common concerns rather than, you know, the nationalism and populism that... in our world too. And then on an individual level or in a smaller social level, can each of us remember, okay, when my life resumes its busyness, can I remember what I learned was important at this time?

[80:24]

Can I remember that it's important just to email somebody and say, how are you doing? Are you okay? I mean, this virus is just one part of a continuing story of our life. Thank you. Nice to see you. Good to see you. Jody. Hi, Paul. Hi, Jody. There isn't any place in the world that I would rather be than where you are right now. So first, thank you for bringing us there. I think it's the best medicine I've had in a month to spend an hour and a half with you in the Tassajara Zendo. I think in some ways my question follows from Laura's, and maybe you've addressed it, but I'll say it another way.

[81:28]

This virus doesn't affect us all in the same way. it preys on the weakest, on the eldest, on the poorest in its economic effects, on people of color, on people who already had existing health conditions, many of which were brought about by poverty and poor health care in their communities. And I guess where I'm struggling is... I can do the, well, you know, when we all get to the other side of this, we're really gonna clean up our acts. But what do we do about this now? I think the first thing to do is acknowledge the lessons we're learning. And I would also say, I think throughout our lives,

[82:31]

we we've received many teachings and many learnings and how early have they registered, you know, like, have we done the inner alchemy that helps something to turn from a concept into something that becomes part of who we are and who we're going to be. That's the challenge for us. And, and I would say some of the things you outlined are an inevitable part of the human condition. And then some of them are primarily the consequences of our political structures and our economic structures. And I think the first one is asking for a deep compassionate acceptance. And maybe the second one is asking for a more proactive and thoughtful. I mean, I think

[83:32]

as Buddhist practitioners and Zen practitioners, our non-dual approach, that we're not doing this because someone else is wrong and they need to be rebuked in some way. I think the compassion and tolerance of our tradition is that we can all behave in ways that are misguided and we all need to look carefully at what we're doing and the consequences of it and be honest about what those consequences create. And I realize it's maybe a little naive to say, but I'll say it anyway, my hope is that this pandemic

[84:33]

will teach us how to be a more global society and out of this marriage values. I mean, I think we're tentatively learning, well, if we're gonna deal with this, we need to collaborate on the data we're providing for each other, on what our particular country's research has created. I mean, I would say all the major issues in front of us are asking for that collaboration. And I would also say, somewhat cynically and somewhat optimistically, it seems like the human condition is that we need things to be quite bad before we're prompted to say, okay, I really got to clean up my act. Yeah. And would that be a picture of Bhutan behind you?

[85:36]

That's Ladakh, Paul. That's my other other home. So that's the Zanskar Valley in Ladakh. Wonderful. Lovely to see you. Frederick. Good morning, Paul. Thank you for your brilliant presentation. I have been reflecting on the appropriate response and have been thinking about a favorite series of mine called the Ox Herding Pictures. I drew the ox and drew the little person thinking it may be me on the ox, the eight pictures of the ox. and the confronting one's ego.

[86:37]

And the last picture is the student returning to town to then share what one has learned. Maybe is there an opportunity for us to extend the social media gathering place that we have perhaps soon or certainly when we come to the resolution point of this which hopefully we'll get to the not too distant future might we include that person that's the neighbor who represents us as a city council person or might we include someone who's maybe a neighbor a little bit further that represents us in the state capital wherever we may be to start to talk to them about a more compassionate economics so that we take our support, our wisdom, the Sangha that we have built, to include it more in the social sense, not in the social sense, but in the civil, in the civic realm, because we don't, I feel, discuss nearly enough the possibilities that we have as a Sangha in the world.

[88:01]

So Freddy, part of my thinking in setting up this phrase, what I would like you to know, is that just the way you spoke, it's like you were answering, you were following on from that statement. I would like you to know these kinds of inclusion, these kinds of connections, are important you know because this is this is our our learning you know can we share our learning with each other not in a pompous way but that each human experience is precious and each human experience uh creates its knowing and as i was saying in the talk when we speak from that place you know uh something is added to the collective no we speak from that deep place that isn't just another repetition of our own confusion that we've been touched deeply and we speak from a deep place i think is a uh

[89:32]

powerful contribution. In a way, when I was recounting the community meeting we had here, you know, that's what was in the room, speaking from a deep place. And its encouragement had a thoroughness to it without any specificity, you know? Oh, I'm encouraged because I know for a fact we're going to get this at the end or this is going to happen. Now, the encouragement, yeah, it was encouraged. It was heartfelt. The heart was nourished. Could I ask you if you think that there is a place for the San Francisco Zen Center to entertain or consider how we may have support in, well, with this technology and with other bulletin boards, with the specific opportunity we have to take this into the body politic because we're going into another realm.

[90:59]

When we talk to a counselor, at the city level or a legislator at the state level in other words if we had oh many how many ever others that would participate we would know that we're not acting on our own but that we actually have a song that's reaching reaching out to our neighbors who happen to be our representative Because I think, Paul, there is a vacuum that's being created, isn't there? This conservative economist Milton Friedman said that when a vacuum is created, there will be something that will step into that vacuum. And I hope that it is a world of sensitivity and compassion rather than greed. Mm-hmm.

[92:00]

I don't know how much you know about it, but, um, one of the previous governors, Jerry Brown was, was at different times in his life, had a connection to Zen center. Right. And, and certain has his approach to both being a governor and a mayor of Oakland was strongly influenced by his sense of present practice. Um, But it's a wonderful point to bring up and please feel encouraged to pursue it. I think of Zen center in this one, I think at the heart of it, we're trying to quite literally each of us individually and collectively trying to realize the essence of practice. And then each of us individually and collectively governing, what is it to apply that to how we live, the society we live in, the commercial structure we live in, the political structure?

[93:15]

I think this is the bodhisattva vow, that we don't do this in isolation. We did this in... deep into being. And it takes as many expressions as a human life does. And politics is one of those. And the question would be, does the co-organization need to, or is it appropriate for the co-organization to follow, to put energy and resources into that political, or I would suggest the core organization can inspire, support, and encourage those who wish to pursue the political. Now, I would tell you, you know, that in the past at city center, whenever we would have elections coming up, we would invite the various candidates to come to the center and have

[94:26]

a debate night. We did that with city supervisors. And it was very instructive. And what I've noticed at Zen's Henry is that different kinds of things can come to the surface and it depends who gives them energy, you know? And it doesn't have to be, you know, people in the hierarchy within the Zen Center. It can be those who have passion for the issue. And my notion of Zen Center that it should be porous in this way, that it should have these many tentacles that reach out into all the aspects of our life. Yes. And I appreciate the Zen Center's participation and previous involvement. Thank you very much. Deep Gasha.

[95:28]

Thank you. Emily. Can you hear me? Yes, I can now. How delightful. Yeah, I echo what everyone says about the preciousness of being able to see you in the Zendo and know that the cherry blossom is extravagant. I think I have a question that follows up kind of on what Laura was talking about. And I'm curious about your thoughts on functional denial. I feel like... Oh, did it cut out? No, it didn't. I was just curious as to what you meant by functional denial.

[96:33]

Right. So, you know, I've been studying a lot of neurobiology, and what I know is that if the limbic system, our survival system, gets triggered, and particularly if there's trauma, it actually shuts off access to the prefrontal cortices that are like the center of awareness. Yeah. So kind of, you know, if you work with someone with trauma or if you work with your own nervous system, and that's what Zazen is, is like developing our capacity to bring awareness to this survival mechanism state. And that's how the past is integrated with the present. And so for me, like the functional denial is I really need to care for my nervous system right now. And it's really important for me to maintain my capacity to be aware. But then I think about what I have to cut off to do that.

[97:35]

And for me, that means not watching the news very often. And so I'm just curious about how we make those choices, because in a way, what we cut off is an exercise of privilege. You know what I mean? Yes, I do. Yeah. So I'm like... with that for myself. And, you know, ultimately, I think it's so important that we keep our capacity to be aware always, but we can't always control conditions. But, like, the active blocking off of conditions is interesting. If we look at ourselves as an organism that's always trying to sustain its homeostasis, You know, we can see that as we introduce the request to be aware, that we're also challenging the many ways the body and the mind have created for themselves coping mechanisms.

[98:41]

You know, as you just said, well, one of the problem mechanisms is to shut down. And then we could say, which is one of the very early teachings of Buddhism, That is, we're promoting this awareness. There's two factors. One factor is stabilization, and then the other one is openly. And they're not in competition, but they are more, both are acknowledging the human tendency to sort of calcify in its efforts to create homeostasis and that each of us needs to tend to that balance and that interplay and discover what's appropriate for ourselves at any particular time. And then I would say, you know, the word I would use would be the yoga of practice is to delve into

[99:51]

the yogic skill of stabilization and the yogic skill of opening. Because both of them require a skill from this. That stabilization is not avoidance. Maybe we could say it's, rather than use the term functional denial, I would use... um functional um which you draw in in a way because the media you know the the design of media is to correct create attention to their particular news outline or whatever you know so to give it drama to give it a kind of a start message.

[100:59]

That's what draws me. If it's classified in a more matter of fact way, then to our nervous system, it would be a lot less impactful. And it could just be quite simply still as informative know this about the world we're dealing you know what is it that that sets my nervous system on edge what is it that that um leaves me feeling overwhelmed or confused you know and then what is it helps helps me to create stabilization and a sense of buoyancy and power of it Thank you.

[102:01]

I like that frame of renunciation. I'm just thinking about some of the awareness work I've done as a white person, kind of facing the trauma of slavery or something and how that can like, the immense pain of that reality can be overwhelming, you know? And so I just don't want to be like cutting off things that are part of the awakening of my own heart, you know? Yes, exactly. But I'd love, I do love the reframe to renunciation. I think that's beautiful for me. Thank you. Lucien Sans, shall we say these two more questions? Yes, we here have a schedule, as you might know. And yes. Maybe two brief questions. Okay.

[103:02]

The next person simply has the name iPhone. I'll unmute you now. Am I iPhone? That's you. Me? Yes. Well, I want to say to Abbott Paul that I saw him in December and he told me how Santa Claus comes down the ladder outside the San Francisco Zen Center to see the children. So I am very glad that you are doing this. I am in Venice, California. We are under lockdown. So I want to thank you for doing this, and I hope that you can continue doing these.

[104:08]

And I just want to say that down here, I am toggling between Zoom at Angel City Zen Center in Echo Park and Zoom against the stream Theravada. Buddhist association, and I cherish getting the chance to talk or just listen to the different Buddhist practitioners that I have experienced in person or in retreat. So I hope that someday the different Buddhist practitioners, including can come together for like a super jam so they can sit together in person or in Zoom and give us their various takes on life because as different as you all may be, you are all a precious experience to us in your difference and ecumenicalism

[105:26]

would be a gift to us. Well, thank you. The last question will come from someone with the screen name administrator. I don't know how I get that name. I'm Cecile. Cecile, where are you, Paul? I want to see the screen. Okay. Hi, Paul. Thank you so much for your teachings. I always look forward to the live stream very, very much. And I just want to talk about all the exquisite things that have happened, and they're very radical. The head of the United Nations asked that all wars stop.

[106:28]

And this should, of course, be the top news of the day. And it doesn't get that promotion because of our crazy media system. But there are radical things happening. I live in a small part of Berkeley where there were 69 next door neighbors asking to shop for me as an elder. And there's so much extraordinary things. And I have a little, small little poem from Amachai, Yehuda Amachai. Behind all this, some great happiness is hiding. And I love that quote from Amachai. I just feel very, very positive about things that are happening. The governor, Gavin Newsom, has been really radical, I feel.

[107:29]

In his inauguration speech, his two-and-a-half-year-old crawled up on the stage, and instead of him handing the baby back to the wifey, he held the child and delivered the rest of his speech. That's radical. So there is movement happening, I think. And we do have to... you know, really get rid of this consumer society so that we can experience the great hidden happiness that is there for us. So I just wanted to say those few things. Thank you so much. Nice to see you. Thank you so much, Paul. And thank you everyone for listening in and hopefully we'll all see each other again at some other time so maybe online or maybe in person who knows maybe this won't last forever okay thank you very much take care

[108:41]

It seems Ryushin left without our closing verse. If we'd like, we can do this together. Chanting together with our sound on would be cacophonous. So we'll continue with microphones muted, but we'll carry on. May our intention equally extend to every being and place. With the true merit of God's way. Beams are numberless. I vow to save them. Delusions are inexhaustible. I vow to end them. Dharma gates are boundless. I vow to enter them. but does way is unsurpassable i vow to become it thanks so much everyone please take good care that's great thank you wow right there having any trouble finding um elastic i read there was

[110:51]

A challenge finding elastic things to go over the years. Now do what?

[110:56]

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