This podcast is offered by the San Francisco Zen Center on the web at sfzc.org. Our public programs are made possible by donations from people like you. Wonderful to be back here in the Zendo on a Sunday. Very close to food. And to all of you and also very close. To those of you online right here about eight inches from my face, thank you for being here and continuing to practice with us as we move back into in-person, those of us in residence here who can. Does sound okay? Too loud in here? You hear in the back? So Fu has been sharing with us the image.

[01:11]

Maybe you've been playing with it, seeing it. The image of us here riding on the great sea turtle. This dream of our ancestor Shurto, who pictured himself riding on a sea turtle. alongside his friend, the sixth ancestor, Huyneng, floating on the inconceivable ocean of reality. Riding together on this turtle of knowledge, this turtle of knowing, bobbing up and down, a rocking on the inconceivable ocean of reality itself. So that's been my image here when I sit in the Zendo with you all, my image of the practice period.

[02:17]

All of us gathered up on this big turtle, holding on and letting go. You know, writing here, knowing what we know and thinking what we think and saying what we say. And meantime, all the while, held up, buoyed up by a floating on this boundlessly deep, inconceivable reality ocean. Which is totally untouched. And totally unperturbed by our various thinking and knowing and saying.

[03:18]

And of course, in our school, we ride turtles together. There may be some place you can go to ride a turtle alone. There may be some solo turtle riders, but that is not our way. We have a long tradition of riding turtles together. And that's what we're doing here in Lizendo here, including all of those online. in the practice period, in the whole wide sangha, all beings actually, all beings together on this very large and very strong turtle. So this image is about the relationship between the absolute and the relative, as Fu was sharing with us. We're separate beings. each on our little patch of turtle shell.

[04:24]

So we're separate beings on this turtle. We're knowing things and thinking things. And all the while, this absolute reality is all around. Intimate relationship of the relative, the different, the separation, the knowing, and this unthinkable, unknowable relationship. inconceivable reality. So in Zen, as you all know, we are very concerned, very interested in how these two interact. How this absolute and relative, the inconceivable and the comparative interact, or how the embodied wisdom, the embodied intuitive wisdom, knowing, and the mental thinking interact. So this turtle on the ocean is a nice image for how they interact together.

[05:30]

A part of what I appreciate about it is that, you know, we often use this language of the middle, and the middle makes it sound like a line, you know, with two N, then you're supposed to be in the middle. The turtle in the ocean is not quite like that. It's a little bit more interesting, the relationship. It's a little more like, again, as Fu has shared, quoting Suzuki Roshi, the feeling of big mind caring for small mind. This inconceivable ocean caring for, buoying up this small mind turtle. So in this image, of course, they're harmonized, and that's what we're studying. How to harmonize. these two dimensions of reality. So to the extent that our practice is to harmonize these two,

[06:46]

The things we don't know and the way that what we are is totally beyond knowing. To the extent that we're harmonizing these two, each of them need to be strong. And that's what I'm turning today. And what I'm wanting to share is that to harmonize these two sides, these two truths, these two dimensions or aspects, each needs to be strong. And complete. They each need to have their integrity and then they harmonize. Beautiful word to harmonize. We're exploring that as we start chanting again after so long. Really being in this full zendo chanting together. Harmonizing is that each thing has its strength. Each voice with its full strength. you know, meeting and joining with the others.

[07:51]

We don't harmonize by disappearing. And in the same way, the absolute doesn't harmonize with the relative by disappearing, and the relative doesn't harmonize with the absolute by disappearing. Each brings and holds to its integrity, its strength. So I'm thinking how strong and whole and complete this turtle is in order to be floating with all of us. And how strong and clear and vast the ocean needs to be to hold this whole project up. So in Zen Mind, Beginner's Mind... When Suzuki Roshi talks about the Heart Sutra lines, a form is emptiness, emptiness is form.

[08:54]

He really emphasizes this point about how before we talk about them being each other, each one needs to be itself. So his emphasis is form is form and emptiness is emptiness. We try to mix them up, you know, put them in the blender, form an emptiness. I don't even know which one is which. They lose something and we lose something in that kind of blending up understanding. So his teaching is that when form is form, when emptiness is emptiness, then emptiness is form and form is emptiness. This is the most complete understanding that keeps the integrity and no disappearing. So likewise, how do I become one with you? And how do you become one with me?

[09:58]

The teaching is, when I'm fully me, when I'm completely me, right where I am, and you're completely you, right where you are, that's how we merge. That's how we harmonize. That's how we're one. I don't try to lose myself into you, and you don't try to lose yourself into me. Each thing... In its place. So when we chant, you know, sometimes it just is too hard. And it's easier to just not chant than to try to harmonize. But of course it's more fulfilling, most fulfilling to bring our full voice. And meet each of the other full voices. Connect in our integrity and solidity. So another of the many images for this harmony. Hearing the harmony of the raindrops today.

[11:05]

As Dogen said, this one true thing. These raindrops on the roof. our breath and our body harmonize with this wind and rain. So one of the wonderful images in the Sandokai, the harmony of difference and equality of this interaction is light and dark oppose one another like the front and back foot in walking. So the light of difference and thinking and the dark of the boundless inconceivable, these, not so much a middle, they function together in some kind of tension and some kind of opposition, like the front and back foot in walking.

[12:31]

front and back foot, you know, pushing, opposing each other, creating the walking together. So I've had this image in mind, front and back foot in walking. And I'm asking myself of my own practice, in my practice body, you know, how's the walking going? How is my walking? How is your walking? Is it two-footed walking or one-footed walking? Hopping on one foot or dragging? Are the front and back feet of my practice each fully functioning to create the movement on the path? And maybe you see your practice body on wheels.

[13:41]

And the question is the same. Are both wheels fully rolling? Are both wheels rolling free? Or is one wheel caught, you know, spinning around? Try harder. Go faster. It's not working. So we go harder on the one wheel that works. Are the front and back foot of my practice both fully functioning? So we often teach the relative truth. All kinds of different relative truths. All day long, hopefully. We're sharing and hearing and practicing these relative truths. Like how to keep your robes more or less on your body. How to practice the precept.

[14:42]

How to care for objects. How to understand in our mind, with our ideas, the Dharma. How to be kind to one another. And I'm thinking of this, all of these teachings, as the front foot. That's the front foot, the vital front foot. We say this front foot is the one great causal condition of our lineage, of our practice. There's no way to enter this lineage. There's no way to enter this practice without that front foot of the relative truth. It's not optional. It's not like the B-side truth. It is completely vital. It is the causal condition of the path. And then we also teach often by using words or gestures for presence.

[15:47]

or breath, to try to point to the absolute truth. And everything helps us with that. I like the rain, the best pointer of all. You know, pointing to this fact of our life, inconceivable, unknowable fact of our life. Maybe you've heard those kinds of pointers and maybe sometimes you've followed the finger to feel that inconceivable present life. So we say things like everything is just a projection of mind, dreamlike and insubstantial.

[16:52]

Or we say that everything is empty or boundless, without any separation or any definition at all. Or we say that the whole universe, that in the whole universe, there's not anything, Not you and not me. And no zendos or cushions or computers or buildings or wind even. But just Buddha nature. Just Buddha nature, luminous and clear. This is the back foot of the teaching. So how are your feet? How is the back foot? How is the front foot? So when I inquire gently, kindly into the health of my own back foot, you know, it sounds something like, is there really refuge in Buddha?

[18:09]

Am I really living in refuge in Buddha? Is the spaciousness of Zazen practice present and available in my life? We say, you know, every morning we chant, the perfection of wisdom brings light and disperses the gloom and darkness of delusion. So is that light around? Am I using that light? Am I seeing that light? do I just say so in the morning? And then hop off on my front foot to do my life, do my day. With no help from Prajnaparamita, thank you very much. Am I feeling supported?

[19:14]

Am I feeling the buoyancy of the ocean of reality? And now and then, Am I diving off? This is what I want to do now and then with you all in this very room. Dive off the turtle into this ocean. A nice little morning dip into the icy cold depths of the reality ocean. Am I caring for my morning swim? taking the time to touch the inconceivable fact of our life?

[20:14]

I'm spending a lot of hours in this room, but am I taking the chance, you know, to really touch the inconceivable fact of my life, to use that time in here to nourish and feed and cultivate that part? So, you know, there's a lot to Zazen. There's a lot of ways of talking about Zazen. Our Shikantaza practice has itself the harmony of the absolute and relative. Our Zazen itself is these things all completely merged and imbalanced. And yet, at a more coarse, sort of everyday, simple level, We often say, our late teacher Mel Weitzman often used to say, and Shohaku Okamura Roshi says really quite powerfully, and I think Suzuki Roshi also speaks in this way, if a little bit more subtly maybe, that Zazen is our time.

[21:32]

So, you know, forgive me for misleading you, but how about this? How about this simple idea? Zazen is our time to touch the absolute truth of our life. That's what that time is for. That's what that sound, that's what the Han is for. Time to go touch the inconceivable, unknowable depth of our life. That's what that's for. It's not for composing emails or... thinking about past and future. It's just about touching this absolute, adept, inconceivable fact of our life. You know, the way Mel would talk about it is that Zazen is like the forgetting. Zazen is the dark, you know, and that's why the lights are dim.

[22:38]

Coming to Zazen, we just... We just be, again, forgive me, non-dual. We just stop. We forget all about who we are and what it is. And just be in this ocean. And then, you know, gradually or all of a sudden, the lights turn up. And we unfold our legs or stand up from our chair and move into our day. There's the light, the difference, the separation, the remembering. I'm not entirely sure about kinhin or soji. Those are these kind of intermediate stages maybe for another time. Which one is soji? So I want to practice this way, and I'm trying to encourage myself to practice this way.

[23:45]

And I guess this morning I'm inviting you to consider if you'd like to practice this way, a kind of simple-minded, not-too-sophisticated way of practice where we sit and do the absolute. We sit and forget everything, and then we get up and just have our life, just do our life. We do this again and again, flowing between these two. A darkness and light, forgetting and remembering. And as we flow between them, we're weaving something. We're weaving something together. Eventually, you know, the dream, the view, the idea, the path, is that every day doing this, weaving a little bit of zazen, a little bit of daily life. We're weaving this path. This brocade, you know, that eventually maybe will be so tightly woven, so seamless, that none of the edges are left.

[24:48]

Just one smooth, solid fabric of a fully integrated life, a fully integrated being. What do you hear when you hear the Han go? I know sometimes the first word or first thought is one that maybe shouldn't be repeated on the occasion of a Dharma talk.

[25:58]

So soon. What is that calling? What is that calling you to? that that's calling me to be to something different. That's like a rupture. It's a break. It's a different kind of time, a different kind of space, a different place of practice. So this is the two strands. You know, we have our daily life and we have our Zazen practice. And then we hear that there's supposed to be nothing special and we're not supposed to like be, make, you know, it's supposed to be the same. So then my worry and my experience is that we miss. that there are two strands that need to be woven. It's not just one kind of like... undistinguished mass of confusion and greed and hatred, basically. So what if they're separate? What if Zazen is absolute, daily life is relative? And then we'll work on the nuance later, you know? So thinking about this...

[27:05]

the separation of zazen and daily life versus the merging, the unity of zazen and daily life. I was remembering my experience of a couple of different temples, monasteries that I had the opportunity to stay in in Japan long ago when I was training there. So as many of you know, in Japanese sotos and monastery, the zendo also serves as the dormitory. So it's one practice hall called the Sodo. And we've tried now and then to practice that way here at Zen Center. We often practice going to sleep on our seat. But we've sometimes tried lying down to go to sleep at night, which is the Sodo practice. You lay out your bedding, those ending bells, that beautiful array of sounds at the end of the night calling us into that darkness. We hear those and gradually lay out our own bedding at the same sight of our sleeping.

[28:08]

So beautiful. And we've tried now and then to do that here. I think that's part of the reason batons are so deep. Some dream, along with turtle dreams, some dream that someday we could stretch out on these tons, each one at our seat, and continue zazen as we sleep. So beautiful. You know, to go to sleep, to go to bed in such a way, even the going to sleep, is like the Han, you know, awake, awake. Don't waste your life. Don't waste time. So, you know, at one of the temples I stayed at, this very beautiful old temple, I really felt how having the sleeping place in the Zendo was transformative in this way of my going to sleep. My sleeping was included in Zazen. And going to sleep was a sacred act. It was a devotional act. I felt that I was laying out my bedding in the Zendo.

[29:12]

And at another temple I stayed in, which is also beautiful and quite old, but a little rougher around the edges, there a similar practice was observed, but my feeling about it was totally different. There the dormitory, also the dormitory and the zendo were one. But instead of feeling like I was sleeping in the zendo, I sort of felt like I had to do zazen in the dorm. It's like all this stuff is my socks under the cushion. The feeling that I'm doing all kinds of things in the dorm, and one of those things is zazen. And the zendo became unspecial. It was just the place of ordinary busy activity. And zazen is just another thing to do there. So maybe, I hope this is communicating something. Maybe you know what I mean. Zazen and daily life, of course, are one.

[30:16]

But which one are they? I think often the zazen and daily life are one means Yeah, I don't feel anything in Zazen. It's just like the rest of my stupid, confused day, you know? The idea of Zazen and daily life as one, the call of that, the opportunity of that, is more like the other, more like the daily life suffused, you know, in the breeze, the salty taste of this Zazen ocean. Zazen and daily life are the same. In that they're both Zazen. I have been flowing into this room, you know. We step over the threshold. We hear the Han. We have our experience of that. We have our reaction. Then we walk into this hall. We step with our foot over the threshold, entering sacred place and sacred time to do nothing but touch this absolute, inconceivable essence of what we are.

[31:23]

Nothing else. This room is not for something else. Suzuki Roshi says, the main purpose of our practice is to find or to realize what we are and what things are in its true sense. We come in here or wherever we're sitting, we take our seat in Zazen in order to realize what we are and what things are. In their true sense. I don't know how we do that. No. But we step into the room. We take our seat. Wanting to do that. Knowing that that's what it's for. Who am I? What is this life? In its true sense. Not in my idea sense. Not in my busy mindset.

[32:25]

But what is this in its true sense? We're here to realize that and our inquiry invites that realization. That's what this room and these seats are for. And is that what we're using them for? Is that what I'm using them for? I hop in here too on my front foot. Does that back foot ever touch ground? Suzuki Roshi says, on your black cushion, when you find yourself in its true sense, you exist there. That you exist there means that everything exists in the same way that you exist. The way you exist on your black cushion is the way each thing exists in its own position.

[33:29]

On this cushion we're sitting on, when we find ourselves in its true sense, We are right here. And the way that we are right here is the way that everything is right where it is. Totally impossible and probably pointless to try to talk about, but it's so beautiful. The way you exist on your black cushion is the way each thing exists in its own position. That's what we're here realizing. How we are and how we are is just how everything is right where it is. So that's what Suzuki Roshi says is the purpose of our practice. To realize what we are in its true sense. And then to weave and then to stand up.

[34:45]

He continues, when your life is based on Zazen practice, You will always be in good harmony with your family, with your neighbors and things you encounter. You will not make excessive effort and you will not be idle. You will do exactly what is needed. So he doesn't exactly tell us. how to do such a thing. Various, various of us, you know, various people sell various things, but no one really can tell us how to dive off the turtle or how to swim in the ocean of our own life. What we offer, you know, in Soto Zen is not so much instruction.

[35:48]

to the great consternation and frustration of many of us for millennia, I think. Yeah, but what do we do? Yeah, but how do we do it? You know, what we offer is inspiration. We offer intention and encouragement. So what we bring isn't so much an instruction or a plan for Zazen. Thank you, kitchen. If any of you online need to go make lunch, now is also the appropriate time to do so. I thank you for caring for each other. The dining car on the turtle. So what we have, you know, what we bring, I think, in Soto Zen is just this intention, this clarity of intention.

[36:58]

Step into the room. I am here to find my true self, to understand and feel fully be my true life. I don't know how to do that, but that's what I want. I have this intention and I have a wall, you know? I have a wall and an intention and a body. And then there's sound and light. And if we're lucky, some people next to us with the same intention. So I do want to end soon. But Paul Haller had the most beautiful quote, the most beautiful quote about our practice. from an author that was not Paul Haller. And this teaching is, this poem, this quote is, if you want to build a ship, if you want to build a ship, you don't call together a group of people, divide them into groups, and give them orders.

[38:13]

Ascending one group to get the planks and another group to get the nails and a third to draw up the plans. No. Rather, you teach them to long for the vast and endless sea. Oh, beautiful. You don't give orders, you know. You go that way, you go that way, you hammer, you nail, you cut. You just, you know, gather around. And let me tell you a story of the sea. The salty taste. the icy breeze, and to feel how deeply we each want that. And from that longing, you know, the ship is built. That's Soto Zen, really. No instructions. There's just the longing, the intention. How do I become silent and still? You know, how do I dive off the turtle? Anything I think about how to do that, it's like...

[39:15]

You know, what noise and movement do I make to become silent and still? It's all turtle stuff. To really dive, you know, we don't know. But we touch, we remember that we're here for that. I wish I could offer more, you know. I do wish I could tell you how, and maybe somebody can, and I hope that they come and take this seat very soon. You know, what I know is just to sit here upright, wholehearted, warm-hearted, awake, with open eyes, open ears, with this vow or intention to touch the depth of my being.

[40:22]

And the clarity, you know, the clarity of purpose, the clarity of mind and heart, to know that that's what I'm here for and not something else. To hear the Han all period long. So I want to close. Thank you very much for your indulgence and your patient, careful listening. Since we've been speaking some of dreams, I wanted to share one more dream story. This is from the treasury of our ancestors. I think I came across this in Norman Fisher's book. I saw some ancient friends on the path. One said, Master. I had a dream. Will you interpret it for me? The master said, yes. One moment. Stepping out and return with a water basin and towel.

[41:34]

A little bit of ocean water to wash our face. And just come back to now. Just come back to one. And just this is it. And then soon, you know, the lights will come on and we will step into our life. The day unspools and we weave the next thread of this brocade. Thank you very much for coming, those here and those online. Any merit of our practice, whatever foot, whatever wheels, standing or walking, we offer to all living beings. Thank you for listening to this podcast offered by the San Francisco Zen Center.

[42:48]

Our programs are made possible by the donations we receive. Please help us to continue to realize and actualize the practice of giving by offering your financial support. For more information, visit sfcc.org and click Giving. May we fully enjoy the Dharma.

[43:13]

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