This podcast is offered by the San Francisco Zen Center on the web at www.sfzc.org. Our public programs are made possible by donations from people like you. This is the fifth day of the five-day sesheen and the last Dharma talk. And there's a few things I wanted to bring up. I wanted to continue with the mountains and waters and also return to the issue or the subject or the occurrence of shame, which I had brought up a couple days ago as a something many people, all of us maybe, but many people are facing or working with.

[01:11]

So yesterday we discussed the mountains lack none of their proper virtues, hence they are constantly at rest. and constantly walking. And I just wanted to... This word virtue in this sentence is translated by Kaz and Cleary and Nishijima differently. They don't say virtue. Cleary says that quality of walking and another is... characteristic instead of virtue. So virtue, characteristic, quality, the quality of the mountains, the virtue, the characteristic of the mountains. I'm trying to myself move around this word virtue which doesn't quite resonate and maybe it's because I don't understand truly what virtue is.

[02:28]

So the mountains lack none of their proper characteristics or qualities. Hence, they are constantly at rest and constantly walking. Kaz says, mountains do not lack the characteristics of mountains. Therefore, they always abide in ease and always walk. Anjo Anju, Kaz says, abiding at ease, which brings out that peaceful quality, whereas Bielfeld has, you know, just constantly at rest, so abiding in ease. So thinking about, again, which we talked about yesterday, abiding, resting, and walking in rest, in each codependent arising there's complete stillness and rest, and what we call ever-changing than the next moment, which is a different moment.

[03:55]

And if you, you know, in the In the funeral ceremony, in the Buddha's funeral ceremony, there's a part, some of you I'm sure have been to ceremonies, where there's a flame. In the city it's a paper flame. At Green Gulch we have a torch, and the torch to a drum goes round in the circle, and then it goes back the other way, and if you You know, just like on July 4th, if you had a sparkler and you went round and round and round with the sparkler, it looked like circles, right? A whole circle of light. Or you could write your name, you know, or you could zigzag. And you saw the zigzag, right? You saw a Z or the circle. But there was no Z there or circle. There was each moment of light, each moment of the sparkler, So seeing, when we look at a whole life, it looks like one whole life of a person, kind of one circle of fire.

[05:04]

But that each moment around that circle, each second of the clock, you know, is totally still and completes its Dharma position and abiding at rest. And yet, And then there's the next and the next. And viewed from our perspective, it looks like a circle, a circle of fire. One whole life. It doesn't look like what we imagine, moment after moment after moment, separate, abiding, at ease, still. Moments, it looks like change. So these, you know, the ceremonial, of that circle of fire expresses, sometimes very theatrically, you know, with the drum, very powerfully, I should say, this truth of our life that it's a circle of fire.

[06:12]

And you can't, but there's no circle there. But there is a circle there. We see a circle. Where is the circle? So these are the proper qualities and proper virtues and characteristics of mountains. And then the next sentence that Dogen says is, we must devote ourselves to a detailed study of this virtue of walking. They're constantly at rest and constantly walking. We must devote ourselves a thorough study. We must devote ourselves to a detailed study of this virtue of walking. Kaz says, we must examine in detail the characteristic of the mountains walking clearly. That quality of walking should be investigated deeply.

[07:16]

So, from our perspective, we don't have much trouble thinking about mountains. as being stable and still and there. But when we talk about them walking, we don't see it necessarily. But we know it to be true, especially if we investigate carefully enough. We see the change, sometimes dramatically. sometimes slowly. And if you're a scientist coming from that direction, earth studies scientist, we know of the upheavals of mountains. I think we talked about this in class. The oceans, the ocean floor was lifted up into the Himalayas, right?

[08:23]

They found shell fossils in the highest mountains of the world. of the earth. It was once the bottom of the ocean. So there are these changes. Continents used to be together and broke apart and there's an island slowly moving up the coast of California, right? So we have this walking that we need to investigate this change, this constant We must devote ourselves to a detailed study of this virtue of walking. Since the walking of the mountains should be like that of people, why not not doubt that the mountains walk simply because they may not appear to stride like humans?

[09:25]

I think Dogen's speaking to us, you know, even though they don't walk the way someone did a painting of mountains walking with little feet on the bottom. So mountains have their own way of walking, their own, and because they may not appear to stride like humans, one ought not doubt that the mountains walk. just because they have a different form of walking. So we can visualize mountains and we can also visualize the complete reality of our existence and all things and how does that change? What is that? constant walking, that constant change and constant rest.

[10:31]

So I think one question is, are we thoroughly investigating? Are we thoroughly investigating our walking, our coming and going. And I wanted to, yesterday I didn't bring this up, but I had wanted to. This is another image of the reality of all existence. And I thought of this, and then I found it in the commentary by Okamura Roshi, but I had thought of this because When I spoke with everybody during the practice period, beginning of the practice period, about your intention for the practice period, I spoke with each person. And one person mentioned an experience that really exemplified, I felt, this reality of all existence, this reality of all interconnected and the

[11:52]

So I'll relate, and the person, if they feel so inclined, can add. But the person was talking about sailing in a boat out on the ocean and feeling that the boat and the water and the currents and the waves and the wind and the sun, it was all just really one whole. To sail a boat means... To really sail a boat, you have to be attuned to all of that, minutely, because everything's moving and shifting, and if you're not, you could have a big capsizer. So to feel maybe dropping off body and mind and being really at one with the boat, and the waves and the wind and the water and the movement and oneself and without being separated as me sailing boat, but just sailing.

[13:07]

This is sailing. And I had mentioned to the person that Dogen brings this same point up in the fascicle Zenki, total function. Total function. And this is Dogen. This is undivided activity, total function, undivided activity, and it's Rebs Tenzin Zenki. This Zenki is his second name, which he translates as the whole works. The whole works and the whole works. If you get my drift... It's a great translation because it has this flipping back and forth. The whole works. Completely at rest, the whole functions. And it works. And it's walking and moving and it works. It functions.

[14:08]

Anyway, so this is Dogen. He says, birth is just like riding in a boat. You raise the sails and row with the oar. Although you row the boat, although you row, the boat gives you a ride. And without the boat, no one could ride. But you ride in the boat, and your riding makes the boat what it is. Investigate a moment such as this. So, boat, boat implies rider. Otherwise, What is it? It's not a boat. A boat implies water. A boat implies waves and all the properties of what floats and what doesn't and shapes that because of wind. It implies the whole universe, right?

[15:09]

To make a boat, you have to include an oar. It's got to be You know, if you've got an oar, that means you've got something like this that does that, you know, because otherwise it'd be firewood or, you know, it wouldn't function. It functions, but it only functions in relation to this. It's not made kind of unrelated to hands and muscles and bodies and shapes and so... investigate a moment such as this, which is this moment, you know. But this image of boat and you make the boat and the boat makes you. You become a rider, a boat rider, a sailor. And Dogen goes on, at such a moment, which is this moment, there is nothing but the world of the boat.

[16:15]

the sky, the water, and the shore are all the boat's world, which is not the same as the world that is not the boat. When you ride in a boat, your body and mind and the environs together are the undivided activity of the boat. The entire earth and the entire sky are both the undivided activity of the boat. Thus, birth is nothing but you. You are nothing but birth. Now, in reading this and as we investigate thoroughly, you know, the qualities, the characteristics, the virtues of the mountains walking, it's kind of like this, the mountains walking. Everything's there.

[17:16]

But we don't investigate so much this way, I don't think. I need encouragement to investigate this way. And I think our tendency, our conventional way of thinking is, I'm a sailor, this is the boat, and it exists as a boat, independent of me. Or the water, it's the boat that I stick in the water. Right? Don't we think that way? And it's my boat, and it's actually more beautiful than your boat. And my name is better than you. My name and my boat is much more classy and yada yada yada yada, you know, rather than, you know, this undivided activity of rider boat sky water beings, you know. arising altogether with the entire earth and sky, right?

[18:22]

And the environs is all there. Nothing's lacking. It reminds me of, it just occurred to me, Gary Snyder's poem about seeing wild gooseberries or wild, some kind of wild berry, wild berries and I think there's a poem that they, seeing those berries, or maybe it was scat that had berries in it. Do you remember the poem, anybody? Anyway, and that, seeing that implied, you know, no, it couldn't have been the scat because that would have been too close to the bear. I think it just, berries, the fact that berries grew where they grew meant bears who ate them and, you know, helped propagate them through dropping the scat. here and there. And it was this wonderful meditation, really, on interconnectedness, which we can do each moment with each person, each thing, each activity is like that.

[19:29]

But are we investigating? Are we meditating on this? And one might say, well, how come? Why do we need to? I'm happy with my boat being prettier than your boat. But we're not. Actually, that mind of comparing is a suffering mind. And if we're poisoned with greed, hate, and delusion, we may go out one night and vandalize their boat. Thinking in that way produces suffering. and activity that's not in alignment with riding in a boat and being non-dual with earth, sky, and water. So this kind of brings me back to what the Shusō said last night.

[20:32]

If you might recall, she said Zen Master Bao Che Well, you know, why do you keep fanning yourself? You fool, you idiot, you know. The nature of wind is permanent. Why do you keep fanning yourself? And I thought this, for me anyway, it spoke to, this is this question the monk had. The nature of wind is permanent, reaches everywhere. It's constantly abiding. restfully abiding. Enough said. Done. Nature of wind reaches everywhere, and it's constant. It's permanent. It's everlasting and at rest. So what is all this flurry of activity in getting up with the wake-up bell? And Bao Che, as we all know, replied, although you understand that the nature of wind is permanent,

[21:41]

which is actually, according to Suzuki Roshi, kind of ironic. Like, you don't understand anything, but just so you'll listen to me, I'm going to say, although you understand the nature of wind is permanent, you don't understand the meaning of it reaching everywhere. What is the meaning of it reaching everywhere? Asked the monk again. And we all know what happened. The master just kept fanning himself. it reaches to our walking, to our practice, to our activity, to our total undivided activity. Our activity is undivided activity. So all of our activity, it doesn't... Okay. Grazie. Are we back? Sort of? Maybe? Ah, there we go.

[22:41]

Okay. Tutto a posto. What were we talking about? The Master just kept fanning himself, right? So the fanning is, you know, our practice activity, our full Samantabhadra, shining practice activity, is non-dual with this reaching everywhere and rest and abiding, constantly abiding at ease. So if you say, well, you don't have to do that because you're already this, no, actually the two, the constant activity, the constant walking is the expression of the constant at rest each moment. They're not at odds with each other. the undivided activity. This one whole world of the boat, its boatness is activity, is dependently co-arisen moment after moment, undivided.

[23:58]

So I found this particular image and the person who spoke with me about it very very helpful and kind of, there's a lot of clarity there, you know. And as often happens, you know, there's clarity for a moment and then we kind of get fuzzy and forget. Now what does it mean? I had it there for a second, undivided activity. Everything's okay. Whatever I do is Buddha activity if I think of it as Buddha activity. And then we kind of get very mixed up and confused once more. And so... We have to investigate thoroughly and without ceasing for a moment, right? You know, I went to this, this just occurred to me, to the De Young Museum to see two different shows on costumes, actually on, one was Balenciaga.

[25:08]

And the other was somebody West, what's her name, starts with a V. Vivian. Westwood, Westwood. And they're both just absolutely marvelous shows if you like to go and see design, clothes design, women's clothes. And of course, the designs of these clothes and capes and corsets and feathers and embroidery, and it's all about the human body, right? They're made for these bodies, this beautiful, incredible cape thing with this stiffening in the material that sort of stands out with a hooded, anyway, this fantastic, if any of you saw the show, it's really, but that was, you know, in relation to bodies, you know, what human bodies do and how they move and it's not just fashion aside from fashion in a vacuum, you know, it's a vision of human bodies that can be adorned and the way they move, you know, is how the drapery is and

[26:38]

So it's very much like this boat, you know. And I remember thinking that when I was there, that it's bodies that are being designed for. You know, it's not unrelated, nor is anything else, you know. So, let's see. we must devote ourselves to a detailed study of this virtue or quality or characteristic of walking. Since the walking of the mountains should be like that of people, one ought not doubt that the mountains walk simply because they may not appear to stride like humans. This saying of the Buddhas and ancestor, this is dokai, Fuyo dokai, this saying of the Buddha and ancestor has pointed out walking.

[27:41]

The saying is, the blue mountains are constantly walking. It has got, this is an interesting translation, it has got what is fundamental. It has got, I think the saying itself, has got what is fundamental. And we should thoroughly investigate this address on constant walking. So this is twice now that Dogen has said, devote ourselves to a detailed study, thoroughly investigate. And Kaz says, the Buddha's ancestors' words point to walking. This is fundamental understanding. Penetrate these words. And then this sentence, it is constant because it is walking.

[28:43]

It is constant because it is walking. It is this jo-an-ju, this constant at rest, because it is walking. And that, it's like, wait, wait, wait, wait a minute here. It is constant because it is walking. What does Kaz say? Because green mountains walk, they are permanent. And in one of the Notes, I think Nishijima Stevens, it says at this line, it says like pedaling a bicycle. The activity, you pedal, pedal, pedal, which keeps it constant, right? Which keeps it balanced, right? And when you stop pedaling, especially if you have clip-ons or no... You fall over, you've got to keep pedaling, you know? You have to keep fanning. You have to keep practicing. Wow. our activity is ever-changingness, which is constant, which is the only thing that is permanent is impermanence, right?

[29:58]

The way those two work together. So, because Green Mountains walk, they are permanent. It is constant because it is walking. Although the walking of the Blue Mountains is faster than swift as the wind, those in the mountains do not sense this, do not know it. And this phrase, swift as the wind, swift as the wind is just, it's from the Lotus Sutra and Okamura Roshi basically says it's not necessary to even know how the Lotus Sutra uses it. It's just like a term of speech. It just means fast. Although the walking of the blue mountains is faster than swift as the wind, those in the mountains do not sense this, do not know it. So I wanted to spend a little time on that sentence. Those in the mountains, which are all of us, don't sense it and don't know it.

[31:05]

And this phrase, in the mountains... The characters for it are mountain within person, mountain within person, in the mountains. It's translated different ways. Let's see, a person in the mountains, those in the mountains, someone in the mountains. And it is a phrase in the mountains that comes from and harkens back to, which is why these texts are so difficult, it harkens back to a poem that was written by Su Dung Po, the same person who wrote Sound of the Valley Streams, who wrote the poem about, in the night I heard the Sound of the Valley Streams, is the Buddha's broad tongue. He wrote another poem, and then the fifth ancestor wrote a poem,

[32:09]

kind of in relation to that, and then Dogen wrote a poem in relation to that. And they all have this phrase, in the mountains. So I wanted to take a few minutes to look at that with you. And I know some of you don't really like poetry or, I don't know, don't like Dharma talks that have lots of poetry in them. Is that true? I know it's true, I know it's true. I have three long poems that I'm going to regale you with. Anyway, so this first one is Sutungpo, and he's talking about Mount Lu, this mountain range, this mountain in China. So he says, it's talking about Mount Lu, but it's talking about our practice, our practice as people in the mountains, mountain within person, which is us.

[33:11]

And yesterday I said mountaineers, but mountaineers are kind of, they go to the mountains to climb them. And I think we're more, you know, we don't necessarily want to scale the highest peaks of the mountains. We're just in them. We're living them. And they're living us live and be lived by the mountains is mountain. in the mountains. So regarded from one side, an entire range. Picture driving into Tassar. Regarded from one side, an entire range. From another, a single peak. Far, near, high, low, all its parts different from the others. If the true face of Mount Lu cannot be known, it is because the one looking at it is standing in its midst. It's a hard word for me to say. Midst. midst. In its midst.

[34:15]

Can you say that word? Midst. That D kind of eludes me, the midst. Anyway, so here's this mountain range, gorgeous mountain range, or mountain range, whether it's gorgeous or not, is mountain range. and you see all the peaks jagged from, you're turning in the car and you're moving. Then you see kind of one, then you see another, and it's, you know, the true face. Could you say what the true face of Tassar Mountains are? Somebody would say, oh, it's those three sisters, or what do they call the three? Triple treasure. I think we used to call them the three sisters back in the day, those three, you know, that's emblematic Tassar. But somebody else might say, uh-oh, flag rock. That's like Tassajara or the Elephant Mountain when you come in and you see that Elephant Mountain. Do you know the elephant when you come in over the road? Yes? Yes? That's like, oh, that's really Tassajara to see that Elephant. And then there's coming, I drive to Tassajara through Carmel Valley and taking that turn off Highway 1 onto G16 and it's like, oh, I can feel the Tassajara, the foothills of Tassajara Mountain.

[35:31]

grabbing me and starting to draw me in. You know, I can feel it. So, you know, is that Tassar Mountain? What's far, near, high, low, all its parts different from the others? If the true face of Mount Lu cannot be known, it is because the one looking at it is standing in its midst. We're in the middle of it. We're in the middle of our life. So you can't say what it is. you can't say about anybody's life. That's why obituaries and funeral services, sometimes you come out and you say, it missed it. You know, they were so much more than that. And the longest funeral ceremony that I ever was at, it was for Charlotte Selver, who died at 104. And I think people tried, they tried to, you know, describe her life and all it meant to them. And it went on and on and on until one of the last persons who spoke said, this is where it had gotten to in terms of viewed from one side.

[36:41]

This person said, this is after more than two hours, two and a half hours. I never knew Charlotte, but my wife was one of her students, and he had things to say about her, you know, but it had gotten down to, I never knew the woman, but, you know, she was great. Anyway, Norman, at the end, Norman Fisher was douchey. He laid down, literally, he laid down on the bowing mat and put his whisk over his head. It was like... Enough, enough. We have to stop. We cannot describe Mount Lou, you know. Mount Charlotte. It's because the one looking at it is standing in the midst. She had become them. So we can't. We fail to try and describe a life or the teaching or Mount Lou or Tassajara.

[37:43]

We're... We see it from our angle, from our karmic position. So this is Su Tung Po's wonderful poem about Mount Lu. Now Hung Zhur, the fifth ancestor, he says, with coming and going, constantly walking, with coming and going, a person in the mountains understands that blue mountains are his or her body. The blue mountains are the body, and the body is the self. So where can one place the senses and their objects? So this is a person in the mountains with coming and going and constantly walking, understands the mountains are the body. And then he says, and the body is the self. So if the body is the self, what about senses and objects and dualities of that kind?

[38:51]

Anyway, there's more to investigate for this poem. And then we have Dogen, Dogen's poem in relation to Hongzhi's poem. So he says, Dogen, a person in the mountains, this is this, in the mountains, a person in the mountains should love the mountains. with going and coming. The mountains are his or her body. The mountains are the body, but the body is not the self. So where can one find any senses or their objects? So these are all three koan poems, you know, for me. But this line, a person in the mountains should love the mountains, to me, just the way poetry does, it kind of hit something. And he says in Mountains and Waters also, he has a refrain of loving the mountains.

[39:56]

Persons in the mountains, persons within this nexus of total undivided activity. and the reality of our existence, he says, should love the mountains, should love the dependent co-arisen life together, everyone together. With coming and going, the mountains are his or her body. With this walking of the mountains, this entire thing is the body. And he says we should love the body. But he differs with Hongzhi about this point. The mountains are the body, but the body is not the self. And maybe that's... You know, in other places he says the human body, the whole... The human body is the whole universe, so...

[41:05]

I'm not sure about this line in this poem. Maybe he's just arguing with Hongjir or something. So where can one find any senses or objects if it's undivided? So although the walking of the Blue Mountains is faster than swift as the wind, those in the mountains do not sense this, do not know it. And the reason is because they are it. Because we are it. Everywhere I go I encounter it, says Jungshan. It now is me. I now am not it. Maybe that's the same as, but the body is not the self. I now am not it. I, small I, am not it. It now is me. So this, we don't sense it, you know, what it reminds me of often people want to know kind of where, how am I doing, you know?

[42:14]

Could somebody let me know how I'm doing? How's my practice going? Am I, do I get it? Could somebody please say where I am on the, you know, some scale here of am I getting close? We really want to know, right? We want to know the true face of the mountain, but it cannot be known because we are it. And we are our practice, so if somebody tells you, oh yeah, you're thus and so, I think maybe that does us a disservice, even though we do like to be encouraged to keep practicing. The Rohatsu Sesshin, I came forward to Tenshin Roshi and said something about... We had been talking about the koan.

[43:17]

The memorial service, you know, will he come, you know, to the memorial service? I think it's Dungshan asking, Nanyue? No. Nanchuan, will... He'll come if he has a companion. And I asked Reb if I was his companion, something like that. And he said, do you really want to know? And I said, don't tell me, don't tell me. Don't say it. Don't tell me. Don't say it. No. Don't speak. Wouldn't it have been horrible if he had said yes or no? It's just like, can you imagine? Yes, you are my companion. Ah. You know, I've arrived somewhere. And then, no, you're not. Oh, my God. After all these years of expensive training, you know. So we don't want to know. But we do want to know. But we can't know, because we're it.

[44:24]

So the walking of the Blue Mountains is swift as the wind. Those in the mountains do not sense this and do not know it. And I think that feels like if we're completely involved with our full energies and devotion, with what we're, with our activities of sailing our boats and cooking our breakfasts, going to the Zeno, then that's it right there. That is the truth. completely manifested, whether you know it or not. How could you know? To know would be stepping outside and saying, oh, that looks like real practice over there that that person's doing. I hope that's me. All of a sudden, instead of undivided activity, it's divided into good and bad, and good practice, bad practice. Got it, doesn't got it, doesn't have it. So I think to hear this, that we don't sense it, because why?

[45:37]

Because we are it, or we are in the mountains. So we can't feel the movement, just like we can't feel the Earth's movement. You know, we're being hurled through space right now, right? At what, you know... I mean, we know because it gets light and dark that we're spinning, or we now know, but through... various wise scientists or whatever, curious people. But we don't feel it, right? We feel like the sun travels around the sky. What? Yeah, Apollo. Yeah. So I think we know we experience... that at that level, and we know that that's true, and then at all sorts of other more subtle levels. So, let's see.

[46:43]

I think the last point that I had wanted to bring up was, actually I'm going to look at my watch. What I would really like to do today is have us sit as much as we can. And so I'd like to nod to walking after the lecture, just come back to the Zen No. I wanted to bring up this shame. for a moment. And when we're chanting the, and we say, may my past unwholesome or evil or basically causes and conditions, past evil karma has greatly accumulated being the cause and condition of obstacles in practicing the way

[47:59]

And I think the study of karma is complex and vast and has to do with voluntary action but also environmental karmic conditions and all sorts of things. It's very easy to reduce it down to something that sounds... punishments are doled out because you deserve it or something and it's so much more complicated than that and complex. But this creating causes and conditions, obstacles and practicing the way and one of the obstacles is feeling our unworthiness and that we don't have value and we don't And in some way, in a very basic, basic way, we can feel like we're unloved and unlovable, which I think is maybe the most, one of the deepest pains, unfathomably deep pain that is conditioned.

[49:26]

It's a karmic consciousness, karmic formations based on various situations. And this is a very... This is a book that I've had a hard time reading called Turning the Gorgon, A Meditation on Shame by Sandra Edelman. And it's very, very dense. She's Jungian. But this point about feeling... heart or feeling in our core that somehow we're, well, not okay or not valued. And it's not the truth. That is not the truth. Each one of us is an instance of the entire

[50:32]

universe, right? And have our Dharma position, our place, our Dharma position. And in the ordination ceremony, you know, it says after one receives the precepts, you know, you are now Buddha's child You are now Buddha's child. And I know this line of you are, and this is your true family and dress, you know, your Buddha's robe is, this is your true family, your Buddha family. It is speaking to this truth of one's existence as not separate from Buddha. that you are Buddha nature in this form. So in the ordination ceremony it says you are now Buddha's child.

[51:38]

You are seated with Buddha and now Buddha's child. The child image is an image of love and care and support and giving and generosity and and value. You are seated with Buddha and are now Buddha's child. And I think this can be very healing, especially if one is working with some of these issues that are so old, these stories of not being loved or wanted or that there's no place for you on this earth. And this can happen young and it can happen to us when we're older in response to various traumas and so forth. So I wanted to just read this.

[52:44]

Actually, maybe I don't even want to read it. It's very It might be too much, actually, during seshin. But I'll just touch on it. I won't read the whole thing. This is, it kind of describes this feeling of shame, what it feels like, and I resonated quite strongly with it. The part of the shame is the fear. This is according to a particular psychologist. It's connected with the fear of exclusion from human society or abandonment.

[53:49]

It's not a fear of physical death but of psychic extinction. The thought the thought that hell might be a state of eternal shame, shame that is overwhelming and all-consuming pain, encompassing both body and soul, implying utter physical destruction while yet one is being kept intensively alive and conscious. So this is this deeply distressing experience of shame that you're alive and conscious and excluded and abandoned from human society and because you are at core unlovable. This is an excruciating experience. and it may feel like a karmic obstruction, although my past karmic, past karma is greatly accumulated, indeed being the causing of obstacles in practicing the way, like this is a huge, might feel like a huge obstacle in the way, like you can, like a big boulder that, how can you get around that because at core,

[55:23]

you believe this or have this story. And I feel familiar with this and also feel and can attest to the dis... What's the word? Dis... not dismounting, but dismantling, thank you, the dismantling of that through practice, through relationships with other practitioners, through our sangha relationships, the relationships with the precepts, the teachings, zazen, bowing, all the practices. There is a dismantling of this karmic formation, which is... old and frightening and so core that it feels like it's true and it can't be dismantled because it's true.

[56:35]

But I don't believe that and feel it need not be an obstruction, you know, this obstruction. In fact, one one has and one can vow that this will not be an obstruction. I will practice the way and listen to, you know, vow to hear the true Dharma and that upon hearing it no doubt will arise. But this dismantling does, I feel, take a kind of constant walking and constant rest, you know, the two that's what I wanted to bring up today. Are there any comments or questions, anything anyone would like to add? Yes?

[57:44]

As you were talking about we are it, we can't see it because we are it, I kept thinking of Suzuki Roshi saying when people come to the monastery they say oh it's such a special and wonderful place And we don't know that. We're just living our lives doing what we do. And I think of that when people in the summer or at work period say goodbye at the work circle. They're so over and over so filled with whatever is going on here. And the expression that you have no idea how important it is to be out there that you're doing this. And we sort of work Right, right. It's like, can we get over with this already? We've got to get this meal out. It's true, it's true. And I feel everyone's very respectful as they listen to these testimonials, you know, it's like, you know, and then we all bow, but, you know, it's, yeah.

[58:53]

Yes. Right. Yes, yes, that's true. Yeah. It happens at workshops too, you know. You hear it. Yes? I'm wondering if you could help me remember a definition of Buddhism that Satsuki Roshi shared and had it Steve had shared it with us at that January 4th meeting about Buddhism is accepting what is as it is, helping it be its best. You know, I can't remember, but does that sound familiar to people? Say it again. Buddhism is one definition that he gave to... What's his name? Yeah. When she asked him, what is Buddhism?

[59:54]

And he said, Buddhism is... Accepting what is as it is and helping it to be its best. Is that correct? Is that just resonating with me, what is it? I think Abbott Steve from where I recall is inviting us. What is that it? So if I'm feeling shame and fear, I mean, how do I help back that it be its best? Yeah. koan and ongoing koan for me. Yeah. Well, I think helping things be their best, its best, is allowing it to come forward and teach you. You know, that's neither, even the difficult things, shame and... ill will and hatred and greed and all those, if we stay close, stay with it and study it, investigate thoroughly, investigate thoroughly how, what is this, what is this, without making excuses, pushing away, running, or acting it out.

[61:14]

Not suppressing, not repressing, and not acting it out as if I have a right to be mean to whoever I want to, which somebody recently said to me. So what is that? Study. Studying it. And then it's its best because it will teach you. Just like death will teach you. Anything will teach you if you're studying it that way. And it also might teach you that you need to make amends, which is not acting the... acting the poisonous mind or whatever, acting it out, it's appropriate response to a poisonous mind. So it can teach you that too. But we have to study it and investigate and be patient and loving and generous with ourselves and gentle because we often beat ourselves up for feeling our feelings, you know, whatever they are.

[62:21]

And another obstruction is shamelessness that can also be understood as lushlessness. Say it again? Lush? There's like this phrase like not, not blushing, you do something wrong or basically any ideas that having some kind of shame or having some kind of feeling of like, oh, I messed up. Yeah, yeah. And if you don't have that, then the idea is that it's an obstruction because you can't, you know, see it in this case. Yeah. That's what we were talking about yesterday, about Hri and Anapotrapia, those two wholesome dharmas that are, or whenever we were talking about it, one is to actually feel, be able to feel that it matters to you what the wise would reprove. You actually And to do something that's not in alignment with your vows and to feel that, to have a sense of conscience, or we call it conscience, that is wholesome.

[63:52]

And if you don't have that, actually, those are the only two things that are in every, the lack of those two things, mattering what other people, what the wise would improve, or mattering that what you do affects others and not having a sense of your own being ashamed of things that are not in alignment, those are, there's only two, those two are present in every unwholesome act. So with, if you, they're really, really important because without those you can do anything. It's like a sociopath or something. You can do anything because Who cares? You don't have any internal compass and you don't care what anybody else thinks either. So you can do anything, you know, cruel or whatever, if you lack those two. So they're really important. I think that's different than this shame I was talking about.

[64:58]

I think shame is used in different ways. Thank you all very much. Thank you all for... Was that a hand? Oh, I didn't see any. I was just going to mention that when you were talking about virtue and the translation, the different translations that were used, it brought to mind Aristotle's definition of virtue, which he's very known for is virtue ethics and so forth, but... In his definition of virtue, it's that which makes a thing its best. So it's functioning that is its best functioning. So it's a virtue of a knife. Virtue isn't how well it can cut. So it's a characteristic, but it's the highest characteristic.

[66:02]

So it makes, with that definition, it's a little bit more clear about it. Thank you. That which makes a thing its best is the virtue of the mountains and the virtue of... And this walking and resting, constant walking, constant rest is the virtue, these two virtues of the mountain. Thank you. Thank you very much. Thank you for listening to this podcast offered by the San Francisco Zen Center. Our Dharma Talks are offered free of charge, and this is made possible by the donations we receive. Your financial support helps us to continue to offer the Dharma. For more information, visit sfcc.org and click Giving.

[66:47]

@Transcribed_UNK
@Text_v005
@Score_94.38