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The Five Gifts
5/15/2014, Zenju Earthlyn Manuel dharma talk at Tassajara.
This talk explores the integration of poetry and Zen practice, emphasizing the meditative reading of poems such as "The Song of the Jewel Mirror Samadhi" and original compositions to deepen one's understanding of Zen concepts. The discussion highlights the interplay between poetic language and Zen teachings, advocating for a personal engagement with the underlying meanings beyond textual interpretations. It culminates in presenting the "five gifts," a mindfulness practice inspired by Thich Nhat Hanh to cultivate presence and compassion in sangha and individual relationships.
Referenced Works:
- "The Song of the Jewel Mirror Samadhi"
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Explored as a poetic text, inviting contemplation beyond the literal into personal and introspective realms of understanding.
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"Heart Sutra"
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Mentioned as an influential text that shaped the speaker's view of compassion and engagement with Zen practices.
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Thich Nhat Hanh's Teachings (March 2011, France)
- The source of the "five gifts" exercise, emphasizing the importance of presence and compassion. Described in the context of enriching sangha and community interactions.
Additional Literary References:
- "Tell Me Something About Buddhism" with Foreword by Thich Nhat Hanh
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A book written by the speaker, reflecting an integration of Buddhist principles and personal insight.
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"The Way of Tenderness: Awakening Through Race, Sexuality, and Gender"
- The speaker's forthcoming publication, signifying an intersectional approach to Buddhist teachings.
AI Suggested Title: Zen Poetry: Pathways to Presence
This podcast is offered by the San Francisco Zen Center on the web at www.sfzc.org. Our public programs are made possible by donations from people like you. So today I wanted to talk about, I want to present the five gifts and the people say, what are the five gifts? What are the five gifts? And so I will be presenting them to us and to each other, but before we get there, I also wanted to share some poetry that will help us kind of get into that space of receiving gifts. And so I always like to let people know, especially students, I feel like every day we're reading poetry when we chant in the Zendo. So every day there's poetry, you know, and sometimes we get into a routine when we're looking at some of the words.
[01:07]
And so I wanted to, like, recite some of a poem that I like, that I heard this week in Lisenda, that we all chanted, we all sent this poem. And it's the song of the Jewel Mirror Samadhi. Did you know that was a poem? Yes. Yes? So the teaching of thusness has been intimately communicated by Buddhists and ancestors. Now you have it. So keep it well. Filling a silver bowl with snow Filling a silver bowl with snow. Hiding a heron in the moonlight. Taken as similar, they're not the same.
[02:09]
When you mix them, you know where they are. The meaning is not in the words. Yet it responds to the inquiring impulse. The inquiring impulse. Move and you are trapped. Miss and you fall into doubt and vacillation. Turning away and touching are both wrong, for it is like a massive fire. Just to depict it in literary form is to stain it with defilement. It is bright just as midnight. It doesn't appear at dawn. I'm going to stop there. Because when you get here, you can back up and go, the meaning is not in the words. The meaning is not in the words. Where's the meaning?
[03:12]
Where's the meaning? In your heart. In your heart. In your life. The meaning of all the poetry in all the world is in it. It's all poetry. Some of it doesn't have words. That water running is poetry. so I started writing poetry when I was eight years old and I was lucky a teacher I couldn't read I didn't like reading books but I didn't like reading books and so she suggested poetry let's go get a poetry book at least I could get from the beginning to the end of the book and I said oh this is really neat not a lot of words on the code and I started reading it and I understood it and it turned out to be the very thing I needed because then I started writing my own long before I knew people were poets. And so I want to share a poem. So I learned to write them in terms of what I felt was going on in my life without, you know, writing the story.
[04:17]
So it's just really hard. But I feel like the song of the Jill Mirasamani is a very, it could be a complex study. It's one of the ones I would like to study more. and really get into each line and not study the words, but study it through my life as I did with the Heart Sutra when I started with the Heart Sutra. That was my poem when I started. So I lived because I wanted to have that heart, that compassion that was being talked about to Chariputra. And that was being an Avalokiteshvara bodhisattva do, talking about that. in the shape of compassion in that way, so it really touched me. So, the song of the Jewel, Mr. Mahdi, is something I hope when we hear it again, you know, in the Zendo, that you hear the poetry, and that there is Dharma in the poetry. So, when I was Shuso head student at, what's that place, City Center, excuse me, City Center,
[05:23]
And I wrote a lot of poetry, so suddenly. I mean, the first week I was there, and suddenly I was sick, and I wasn't around for like a week or two, and people were just passing me by and passing me by, and no one knew who the Shuso was. They had the name, you know. And then so finally, I think after, and then we missed the entrance ceremony that normally happens in the beginning. Because Blanche had to travel. Blanche Hartman ordained me. And so eventually somewhere in the middle, finally there was that time. And they said, this is the Chusot. And they were like, what? You know, like all this time. They had to sit there talking to me, telling me all about the practice spirit. And it was beautiful to me because I got to meet everyone in a different place without having that over my head. So it was very nice. So I was writing these poems, and they were just coming, and I thought to share. I'm going to share the shorter.
[06:23]
Well, no. Keep watching my time. I'll share this one, The Deep. I think The Deep came first. It's called The Deep. And I felt it had something in it, and I ended up using these poems for my talks, so that's very good. First two weeks, all my talks were done. So The Deep. No one can guide you into your dark, moist interior. I'll say that again. No one can guide you into your dark, moist interior, where the moss has grown in layers, where bamboo could sink itself into you, creating private places. Your innermost earth has no words, so it will not call you. No, the deep does not speak think, or take action. It mysteriously leads you, if you will let it, to familiar rhythms played within.
[07:29]
Eventually, you will go alone, unafraid, into your life, feeling into the dark without doubt that your heart is open. When you're listening to it, maybe just one word, one phrase. That's the thing about poetry. It's like a pie. You just don't eat the whole pie. Take a piece of your pie and you taste it. I'll read it again and see what comes up for you and where your heart settles and where your body settles or unsettles. See where it unsettles as well. The deep. No one can guide you into your dark, moist interior, where the moss has grown in layers, where bamboo could sink itself into you, creating private places. Your innermost earth has no words, so it will not call you.
[08:35]
No, the deep does not speak, think, or take action. It mysteriously leaves you if you will let it to familiar rhythms played within. Eventually, you will go alone, unafraid, into your life, feeling into the dark without doubt that your heart is open. Without doubt that your heart is open. So, anyone in this room, just tell me the one word that stood out for just one word. You have to do two, okay, but one. Moss. Moss. Lead. Lead. Moist. Moist. Moist. Eventually. Eventually. Eventually let the moss lead you.
[09:39]
Thank you for that part. Thank you. Eventually, let the moss lead you. So you can make your own rhythm. Let's get some more words. Feeling. Feeling. Feeling. Open. Open. Alone. Alone. Doubt. Feeling alone with doubt. Let. [...] Let your feelings open. Alone. Without. Let it open. Whether your heart is open or not, it's open. Let it open. If you doubt, it should open. Matter of fact, when you're down, it should open. Probably is the time when it should open. It's probably the exact time. And it's very, very scary. Very scary.
[10:39]
the open when everything feels so close. Any other words? You guys are creating honing other deep, other phases, other deep. And in that, what is touching you is how I feel the Buddha's teachings were meant to touch you in that place. When you hear the chanting or you hear Dharma talk or you hear something of the Dharma, That it touches you in your life experience. So those words are coming from your experience. You're hearing from your experience of life. And that's why I say it's all poetry. It's all poetry when you put it together. But it's not poetry alone, right? We've been talking about Sangha. We're in Sangha week. Many of us are in Sangha week. So the poetry, this poetry here, is interrelated to you and to you back and forth. as a place in which we are mirroring each other's deep.
[11:45]
The words that are coming to you. Any other? Huh? Earth. Earth. And work. The bamboo in the earth. May be where our work is. May be where our work is, not out there. The land we're in the earth. Did I hear something on this side over here? Me too. We said dark. Dark. [...] But the number is you in the earth.
[12:48]
Of the earth. So when I feel like I'm chanting, this is some of the way I chant. Over the years, you know, so I've been chanting this Jiromara Samadhi, the song of the Jiromara Samadhi. And, you know, sometimes I just thought, like, wow, but I don't know what it means. But then I walk with that one. Walking with that one. Okay, let's try another one. This one's really good, especially among sangha. And being together in sangha together, practicing together. And it's called the human race. So, life is no endurance test in which we must race like wild horses being chased from behind. barely hearing the sound of creeks running over small stones. Rushing forward, we fall over jetted cliffs in an earth-pounding gallop to claim the gifts thought to be scarce.
[13:57]
At the bottom of the canyon, the serenity we thought was lost crawls out from inside and presents itself while we are on the ground, while we are on the moon. No need to compete for the inherent gifts. Exhausting ourselves in fierce competition. Making less or more of our lives. Blended by the beauty of another's cloak. Blinded by the beauty of another's cloak. No need to compete for the inherent gifts. Exhausting ourselves in fierce competition. Making less or more of our lives. blended by the beauty of another's cloak. There is no admirable work than to breathe, to turn back in the middle of the race. Avoiding crumbling edges along the way, you return to the creek where water rolls over stones.
[15:02]
And then ever so lightly, you make footprints in the direction of home where your heart lives. where tea is ready and you are invited. Carry it again and find your seed, seeded word. When I say the seeded word, the one that planted inside you would plant it inside you. This is really, I think, speaks to being inside. Life is no endurance test in which we must race like wild horses being chased from behind. Barely hearing the sound of creeks running over small stones. Rushing forward, we fall over jetted cliffs in an earth-pounding gallop to claim the gifts thought to be scarce.
[16:06]
At the bottom of the canyon The serenity we thought was lost crawls out from inside and presents itself while we are on the ground. No need to compete for the inherent gifts, exhausting ourselves in fierce competition, making less or more of our lives, blinded by the beauty of another's cloak. There is no more admirable work than to breathe. So you're already there. To turn back in the middle of the race, avoiding crumbled edges along the way, you return to the creek where water rolls over stones. And then ever so lightly, you make footprints in the direction of home, where your heart lives, where tea is ready, and you are invited. Amen. So all these poems I wrote to myself, you know, was looking at how I was practicing.
[17:23]
How am I practicing with Dharma? What am I doing? What's my motivation there? Because whatever my motivation is, it's going to be the karma. It is going to be the karma. Whatever motivates my actions, whatever motivates your actions, it's going to be the karma. Whatever motivates your body, mind, and speech. And so these things come up inside me and start motivating us to do things. And so I was invited by a teacher a long time ago to look at that. And I still teach that. Why are you here? Be honest to yourself. You don't have to tell anybody. You can whisper it into your pillow. I'm only here for this. And that's okay. It doesn't matter, the reason. What matters is so... You remember that motivation. So when things go like, you remember your motivation. Why you came? Why you here? And you go, oh yeah, I really like whatever.
[18:25]
And see. And see what more is there. What more is there. Anybody have any words they want to make up with? Serenity. Serenity. Competition. Invited. Blinded. Life. Life is competition and we're blinded. Invited. We've been invited into our lives. We're invited into our own lives. We can invite ourselves. Invite ourselves. make tea, two cups, one for you and one for that other. And sit on both sides of the table. You know, and see who speaks, see who talks, see who comes up, see what eye is sitting at the table. Who's on this side of the table having tea and who's on the other side of the table having tea?
[19:30]
And how do they impact how you practice and move in the world? Anybody just have a general comment. You don't have one word, but you have a question at this point. Just want to make sure you're engaged. It's a wonderful picture of Sandra. It's a wonderful picture of Sandra. Can I speak to the last poem? Yes, you can. The deep? The deep. It really reminded me of my ancient Christian poem. Mm-hmm. I was moved by the mercy and the compassion that you have with yourself.
[20:43]
Yeah, it's important. I remember, again, the heart surgery was the song that touched me. And I remember that, and as I practice, that's where we start with the compassion. We start with learning and understanding what that is and how it will work in our life. Because everything we do in the practice, we have to arouse that place. of compassion in our hearts so that we can have it for our lives. So, of course, Zen has a lot of forms, and so you go that way, and everybody else is going that way, and, you know, they sit down, you stand up, you know. All of these things at the beginning, what will you do, you know, you know, like, come on, get it together, or will you be able to accept that as I went this way, they went that way, now I'll go that way. and have that compassion. Now I go that way. Now I know that to walk this way.
[21:47]
I began to see the forms in that way and learn about myself in that way. And then once you get all the forms and you go, oh no, where are you going? That's wrong. Wait a minute. You don't do that to that bowl. Those kind of things start. And then you see another side of yourself. They're not the one that was so Innocent who went that way went that way. Now, oh, no, I know to go this way, and I know that, and I know, and I know, and I know. And what I love about the practice is at that point, usually they kind of step you up to something you don't know. It happens right away, and so there's no end. There's no end to this uncertainty, and I love that. And that's the way poetry reads to me. There's no end to this poem. I mean, we all can... Just write phases and phases and phases together. Even if you didn't know how to write, say you didn't think you knew how to write one. We could bring that together, you know, as a song. As we breathe, you know, I love that place.
[22:49]
There's no more admirable work than to breathe. And I feel like, oh yeah, you know, then to always try to, try to, try to be here, try to be there, try to be over here, try to look like this, try to act like that, try to, you know, all these things that come up, because we're human beings, and these things will come up. It's not a bad thing. It's just understanding human nature and understanding the human condition and how various things, how we are conditioned in those ways. And the practice has taught me that. And I think I'm just so grateful to have walked on this path to understand human condition and to be able to rise, not rise up out of the suffering, but able to have have the suffering come from me and then not be boiled over by it, you know, not be laid down by it. It becomes center to my life, you know, that it's just there. So, I'm going to read this last one of mine. And I feel like this one does speak to that, that suffering.
[23:52]
It feels like it, it, it sort of reminds me of the noble truth, you know. And it sounds like I wrote these all by one. My little city is city center with all the sirens going by in the bed. So that's what I wanted to say because this place can open up even with sirens going by because it's not out there. I mean, that sounds beautiful. I love when I come here. It's like, whoa. Every time I come, it's like, oh, my first time. Every time I come, it feels like my first time. And I just listen to the water. And it's not water that I've heard before. It's in some more water. Some other water is coming through than when I first came. So this is written in the middle of the city. And the water's there. So because everything's interrelated, that you can understand it and live it and know it, that I always tell people there is peace. You know, especially like in Oakland, East Oakland, that's a lot of the island.
[24:56]
But there's peace. but we have to see it and be there for it. We have to be there for it. Invite it. Have tea. Have tea. With the peace that's there. So it helps me not get clinging to that. It has to happen at a place. Even as a writer, I get to go to a cabin, you know. Right. It's been a lot of money. Not necessary. So this one's called Wild Breathing. Um... I wonder why I didn't mention that. Wild breathing. Wild. Like the wild. Wild. Okay. The path is life. And the purpose of life is to live it. Okay, that's it? No. People are always asking me, what's my purpose? Okay. That was it.
[25:57]
Anyway, that's not the whole poem. I just love those. The path is life and the purpose of life is to live it. To be soothed by its waters still flowing and warm by the sun that reaches those who stand boldly in the open. Warm by the sun that reaches those who stand boldly in the open. Live this moment. and life stretches into eternity, revealing the stars flown in the vastness of your night. Hold open what it means to be alive and still breathing, despite all that has burned away and you're living through fire. Dare you sweep up the ashes, whittle and sand the charred pieces, and make a smooth mound of yourself A mound that, if breathed upon, will float you back to the silence of your beginnings.
[27:00]
Your arrival is now. Landing on a new shore, a lifeline cast beyond anything, imposed by the shadows of what appeared as mountains. Beyond the distorted reflection in puddles that seemed to be watering holes. Past the fuel of desire mistaken for the sun. What you want looks like the sun. Might your fear be the onset of freedom from your beliefs causing tremors or the fear that you are still breathing after having spent your generous years at wishing wells? Might your fear be that breathing in and breathing out is too simple of a contribution to the great unsurpassed journey of life no need to gather your breath and store it in your belly your breath is to be heard in the wild nature of all things like a bird song like the call of bison your breath is to be discharged into the world ascended up from the earth of ancestors
[28:21]
Out into the atmosphere of a million realms. This is life. I'll read it again. And after that, we're going to get our gifts and go home. The path is life. And the purpose of life is to live it. to be soothed by its water still flowing and warmed by the sun that reaches those who stand boldly in the open. Live this moment and life stretches into eternity, revealing the stars flung in the vastness of your night. Hold open what it means to be alive and still breathing, despite all that has burned away. in your living through fire.
[29:22]
Dare you sweep up the ashes, whittle and sand the charred pieces, and make a smooth mound of yourself, a mound that, if breathed upon, would float you back to the silence of your beginnings. Your arrival is now. Landing on a new shore, a lifeline cast beyond anything imposed by the shadows of what appeared as mountains, beyond the distorted reflections in puddles that seemed to be watering holes, past the fuel of desire mistaken for the sun. Might your fear be the onset of freedom from your beliefs, causing tremors, or the fear that you are still breathing after having spent your generous years at wishing wells? Might your fear be that breathing in and breathing out is too simple of a contribution to the great unsurpassed journey of life.
[30:27]
No need to gather your breath and store it in your belly. Your breath is to be heard in the wild nature of all things. Like a bird's song. Like the call of bison. Your breath is to be discharged into the world and send it up from the Earth of ancestors out into the atmosphere of a million realms. Don't let anybody take it. This is life. This is your life. Don't anyone take it. And that's what Zune teaches. This is your life. Breathe. Don't let things take it. Careers take it. Notions take it. Breathe. Don't let it happen.
[31:43]
Can we just bow? If you want to. As most people know, I'm very serious about my practice. I'm very serious about the things I do in my life. And I don't like wasting time. You know, my favorite sutra is on the heart. Don't waste time. Earth and death. Earth and death. What's on this heart? Every heart has a different way of saying it. Earth and death. That's what matters. Don't waste this time. So I think it's time for the gifts and then we get here. So I got this from Thich Nhat Hanh. He just happened to be listening to a talk.
[32:43]
He has a talk in France. It was in France in March 2011. So in case you want to hear the entire talk, you can listen to... You know, I've heard many talks from him, and some parts of it resonate, some parts of it don't, but, you know, I really, this one resonated really well, and it was just so simple. And being in song, where we go, sitting at dinner, and it just came to me, I think Elizabeth Alex was at the table, and Robert, and I said, wait a minute, I can't just do the poetry, we have to do the five gifts. And everybody in the workshop was saying, what's the five gifts? What's the five gifts? They wanted to know the five gifts before they came to get the gifts. I was like, you got to come and get the gifts. You got to come and get the gifts. So the title, or at least I've titled this part of his talk, is Your Own Presence is Love.
[33:44]
Your Own Presence is Love. You know, and I think the Buddhist teachings have that way of, for me, my experience is being present. You know, just having that presence. And so his way, he has a way of kind of making these teachings apply. You can actually do something while trying to understand some of this. And so he created these five gifts, you know, and to help us deal with presence and sangha. presence in our family and community presence, you know, just being present in our life. And so there's many of us and we don't have a whole, whole lot of time. So I thought what I'll do is you will stand and I will stand and I will bestow the gifts to you and then you will receive them by making this gesture. So we'll all stand up right now. and take breathe, take, you know, send your breath to the wild, to the wilderness.
[34:55]
And before I do that, I want to say that a little more, Thich Nhat Hanh teaches that one's presence is one's love. At a retreat, he offered five gifts you can verbalize to yourself. I'm going to do it to you, but you can do this to yourself, to a friend, to the earth, or with whom and with Whatever you are cultivating into a relationship, that is important. They are especially helpful when you struggle with others or when a group is struggling. Find a time to give these gifts. All right. So you have to have your hands out to receive the gift. All right. Gift number one, and because you're all very dear to me, my dear, I am here for you. My dear, you don't have to say it. You can later, you can give it back to me. I'm giving it to you. So, my dear, my dear song, I'm here for you.
[36:04]
And then you just take it. I'm here for you. Hands out for gift number two. One. My dear, I know you are there. My dear. My dearest, my dearest, my dearest, I know you are there. I know it. Get the gift on. Gift number two. Gift number three. Hands out for gift number three. My dear, I know you suffer. And that's why I'm here for you. I offer you my presence. My dear, I know you suffer. Offer this. And that's why I'm here for you. I give you my presence. That's it. Okay. Give four is a little.
[37:04]
It has parts to it. Give four is like one of those little boxes. You open up and there's a little box and there's a box and there's a box. Don't break the times out. My dear Sangha. My dear Sangha. I am suffering. Because I can say what that is. I breathe. I breathe the loss. And I want you to know. That's part of it. I want you to know I'm suffering. I'm suffering. And I want you to. That's part of it. That's part of it. the gift for. My dearest, I'm doing my best. I'm doing my best. I'm doing my best. Just a gift I give to you. So, Part C, please help me.
[38:05]
I'm a practitioner. I cannot do it alone. I need you, dear Saga. I cannot do it alone. I cannot take care of myself. This is a wonderful moment. So you feel the joy. So why is it a wonderful moment? It has an adjective. Not why. It's a wonderful moment because of presence. So that's the five gifts. So I wanted you to turn to someone and you're going to give those gifts to someone near you. As song delivers. I don't know that what was, was it hard to say it's something. As time we go through the song, you know, and somebody like falls out or something.
[39:11]
We were like, oh my God. You know, but, you know, we're together because of the first noble truth there is suffering. And so it's not to be ashamed of that. And it's not to be ashamed that we might not know how to change it, you know, or do anything about it other than breathe. So we have five minutes, and if there's any questions, I'll take those. And so pretty much that is my offering for today. Yes. A quick question. Thank you for this exercise. This conversation happened so much. There's so much negative conversations. We live in a world where everybody is not supportive. We do not stop to say, I acknowledge you, I see you, I appreciate you. That was a wonderful exercise. Thank you for sharing. And my question is, what do you do for writer's block? Let's have tea.
[40:12]
At lunch or something. Come sit with me at lunch. I don't really have water block, unfortunately. I wish I could give everybody my words, but I can tell you why I have an overflow. So we'll talk about it. I overflow. Yeah, I kind of wish I could. some of it yeah but I think all of it's spiritual to me you know yeah no matter what I think my poetry has changed a lot from since I was eight of course to now but my poetry was pretty profound when I was in high school I was in a lot of journals I won awards you know I was in English Lit you know no no and I was I had these boxes and boxes from all my childhood and one day I said oh this is filling up my apartment, and I threw it all away. So I don't have anything, but I think that was probably a good thing. You know, my teachers would recite things of what I wrote to the class, and so two of them I remember because I wrote a poem about the assassination of Martin Luther King in old English language.
[41:19]
You know, so I probably could find that because it was published, but I didn't know what that meant, being published and all that. It just didn't make sense to me at all. And then I... wrote a lot about being, you know, um, being somebody, you know, and not feeling that really. And so I still, there's some of that in there still sometimes in my, so my Dharma is, my writing is just the Dharma just reflecting back to me, my life being reflected back, um, in, in words. I saw another hand. Yes. Um, something that I've been really curious about is how in the Zen tradition, um, there's a lot of acknowledgement around the insufficiency of language. And I'm wondering if you can talk just a little bit about how poetry, you know, something that's in language, using that as your creative source rather than, or expression rather than something without language.
[42:23]
It is very difficult. I have other expressions too, creative expressions, painting, and I'm a drummer and things like that. So I can't do, sometimes I need to do those things for the words. English is so dualistic that chorus, you're trying to write something that is like not, you know, in some ways non-dualistic. But I trust my inner most moist interior that it will come out in the way that there's an experience of oneness with everything. So I just know it will come out that way if I stay with how I'm feeling in terms of the essence of things. Because even in Zen sometimes you don't even talk about the essence of things. There's no essence of things. But that's the only word I have. So our language is very, very difficult to... I would say to spell Dharma and, you know, and often feel, you know, I wish I had a lot of other language, you know, that I tried Spanish, I can listen and know it, and French, I know some French, but, or Japanese or anything that wouldn't, that, you know, maybe there's languages that don't have I in it, you know, there's some language I understand that, you know, don't have the word I, you know, so those would be probably closer to, you know, but I don't know them and I just trust that
[43:43]
If I write it just how I feel it, and then if I share it, and then others feel it too, then the I is not there. So it loses the I for me once I share it. And then others join in. And I really like when people find words and you can put them together differently. And I really like that process. Okay, got one more minute. Ellie's recording. It says 29. I don't know. One more question, maybe? The last poem you read, is it possible to have a copy of it to read that book? Yeah, I guess. I don't know. Are you published? Yeah, not my poetry as much, but I am published. I have a book in the bookstore called Tell Me Something About Buddhism and Thich Nhat Hanh, the foreword to that book. And I have a new book coming out in February called The Way of Tenderness Awakening Through Race, Sexuality, and Gender.
[44:50]
And Wisdom Publications is publishing that book, which is kind of their first. Poetry? Poetry, I do have a self-published poetry book. It's an e-book. If you go on Amazon, a lot of this is there. It's an e-book. Poetry, I'm still collecting that poetry book. So I think it's going to take the rest of my life. I've been writing it since I was eight, so... To complete the fortune book. And I have a novel I've written, so I hope that comes out, too. I tell you, I just write, [...] write. Okay. All right. Want to end? Thank you for listening to this podcast offered by the San Francisco Zen Center. Our Dharma Talks are offered free of charge. and this is made possible by the donations we receive. Your financial support helps us to continue to offer the Dharma. For more information, visit sfcc.org and click Giving.
[45:49]
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