I've talked for a little while about some things that I'd like to talk to you about. I mean, you can ask me questions or we can kind of talk together about your ideas about these things. And one of the things I wanted to talk today was about money and where money comes from, just your ideas about it, because money is a very important thing for people. I don't think very often grown-ups really take the trouble to explain to children all about money. I don't think you learn about it in school too much, but it's a really important thing to know about. So what I wanted to do is start out by talking to you about where the idea of money got started and then to talk about where your money comes from, because you all get money. Your parents have money and you get some allowances. You all get allowances, right? Yeah. I'll bet you haven't really thought very carefully about where that money comes from that you get to buy things. So, first of all, I wanted to tell you something you probably don't know.

[01:04]

Are you listening? Which is that for most of the time, human beings that have been on the Earth, they didn't have money. They didn't need money, because people mostly got food by hunting or by growing things, just like we do at Green Village. And they pretty much had what they needed just by doing that. And if people wanted something that they didn't have, like, for instance, suppose I was a hunter and I wanted a knife and I didn't have a knife, and somebody else in my village had a knife. I would go to that person and I'd say, I'd like a knife and I'll give you this jacket and you give me that knife. That's called trading, right? You guys have all traded, right? Yeah. So for a long time, mostly people could just get things that they needed by trading something and they just decide together what would be a fair trade.

[02:04]

For instance, suppose I went to somebody and said, I'd like your knife and I'm going to give you this little piece of dust for your knife. Would that be a fair trade? No. That would be weird. No one would give you a knife for a little piece of dust, right? So people would kind of work out what things were worth. You know the word worth? Yeah. Some things are worth lots, some things aren't worth very much. So, for instance, if you're a hunter, do you think a knife is worth a lot or worth little? No, it's worth a lot because you can hunt things and kill things with a knife. A spear is worth a lot. And if you're cold, a nice warm jacket is worth a lot, right? So let's say that somebody else has a knife but a real warm coat and you're cold and you don't have a coat. You can trade your knife for that coat and then both of you get what you want. Well, after a while people realized that it was easier to trade if they got something that they all could agree on to trade with.

[03:06]

And so some of the first money was things like shells and certain kinds of stones, shiny stones, jewels, and certain metals. Do you know what metals are? What's an example of a metal? Gold. Gold. And iron? Copper. Silver. Bronze. What else? Nickel. Those are all metals. And all of those metals that you guys have mentioned have been used for money. And at first people just used metals or shells or things like that for money just loose. Sometimes the Indians would put them on strings. They put them on a long string. Punch holes in the shells and use those things. Like Harry. You all remember Harry, the old man who died? Harry the Indian? Well, his tribe a long time ago before white men came to California, their money was a certain special kind of shell that was very rare. It was called a dentotic shell. Dentalian shell. And people who were rich had long strings of these shells and had holes punched in them.

[04:11]

And that's what they used to trade. So you could buy things with these shells. And in white people's cultures, the things that they used for money were mostly metals. And eventually they would stamp things on the metals. Usually they'd stamp the picture of the king of the country on the metal. You probably have all seen pictures of old coins with a picture of like an emperor or a king on the coin. Don't you all see pictures like that? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, that's right. And now money is mostly paper. And that's really weird because paper isn't actually worth anything. Right? You can't use paper. You can't. Yeah, that's true. Well, of course they have to make the paper money sort of special or else anybody could make it, right?

[05:12]

So the money that we use now, it used to be that that paper would say on it. Anybody have something like that? Well, maybe Gloria can tell us. Or any... My friend has a necklace with a little horse on it. Out of nickel? Yeah. Well, it used to be that money would say on it. Money, paper money used to say on it that if you went to a bank, you could get metal money for that paper money. So for a while, paper money was in place of metal money. And paper money used to say on it, this dollar, you can go to a bank and get a piece of silver, a silver dollar. How many of you have ever seen a silver dollar? I've got five. Yeah. I've got two. I've got two. It used to be that silver dollars had... They were made out of real silver.

[06:14]

They were made out of real silver and they were real big and heavy and they had dollars worth of silver. There's one dollar. I've got one. Oh, there's a good dollar bill. Let's just look at it. Let's see what it says. Kind of wrinkle up. This is just a piece of paper, but it is special kind of paper. And it's printed on a special press. You know what a printing press is? It comes down and prints some money. That's what they do have. What they have is these big books and they're all filled up with these big books about women's ethics. And they have lots of them in bags and they're just covered with money. Well, every page is just money. We got one for me. Oh, somebody found one. I have no coins. Here's some coins. This says one dollar. It says the United States of America. One dollar. You turn it over and it says one. One's over there. If you spit on fake money, it says you can't write history. And do you guys know what counterfeit money is?

[07:15]

Who knows that word? How do the older kids know? Counterfeit money is money that's fake. It's money that somebody made themselves. People do try to make counterfeit money. They set up a printing press in their basement somewhere. And they try to imitate all these. See, money, you can pass this around. If you look closely, money has all these fine little lines on it. Those little lines are so that it would be very hard for anybody else to make money. Just pass the ones around. See all those fine little lines? Those are very, very hard for anybody to do. And also, Amber is right. The paper is very special. Where's the chair? I don't know. Let's see. Here? Yeah, why don't you look at it? Okay. Wait a minute. Little line. You know whose picture is on the one dollar bill? George Washington. George Washington. Right. And who's on the ten dollar bill there? Hamilton. Who is that? I don't know.

[08:15]

Hamilton. Hamilton. Yeah. He's one of the people called the Founding Fathers. He's one of the people that started the United States. I want to see one of these. Great. That's what's on the ten dollar bill. It is ten dollars. It's a lot of money. Here. Pass that on. Yeah, pass that on. Does anybody know where this money is made? Where this paper money is made? Does anybody know the name of the kind of place that makes money? No. Bank. No. It's called a mint. That's right. It's called a mint. A mint is a place where you make money. I have a joke. Well, it's not time for jokes either. Everybody's looking at the money.

[09:18]

When you're all through looking, I'm going to say a few more things about money. Can you pass me the ten dollar bill? Okay. Did you all see all the little lines? I know. And also on the coins, they used to have a, they used to have, like, come with a little letter on it that told which mint it came from. That's right. But now there's only one mint, I think, that makes coins, so they don't need those letters. What? Like the one in Philadelphia or something. There used to be three. One of them was in San Francisco. Have any of you ever been to the mint in San Francisco? I think so. It's right near Zen Center. It's a great, big, tall building. And they used to actually make money there. They don't make money there anymore. Why not? Because they don't need to. Those are the initials of the guy who... San Francisco. Maybe. I don't know. They're initials of the man who made the picture. Can I see those coins?

[10:20]

Yeah. There's a D on this quarter here. That usually stands for gender, I think. They should check these. See if it makes money or not. You get that little part right there. Amber has a really... Oh, look at this beautiful old coin. This is a silver dollar of 18... I'm going to pass it around. Go back to your place. This is a silver dollar from 1880. It's beautiful. They made it real silver, and that's why it looks so black. Did you get a chance to look at it? That was a century and one year ago. Yep. That would be real hard to make one exactly like this. Right. Now, I'd like to ask you all a question, which is, how do you get money? What are the ways you can think of to get money? Being a job. Being a job. Yeah, Amber. When you watch comedy, you watch movies. Uh-huh. Those are...

[11:21]

That's a kind of job. What other ways can you think of to get money? Tim? Save people. Save people? How do you get money that way? You get famous. You mean, like, if you save somebody's life, they might give you a reward, give you some money? Yeah, like a dog on the bus stop. Yeah, you can get a reward. That's right, a reward is sort of like a way to get money. Can anybody think of any other ways? I don't know how the government gets it. It's the tax money thing. Well, I know. Yeah, that's true, but how do ordinary people like you and I get money? Tim? We get allowances. You get allowances. You can get it from the bank, but the bank just won't give you money if you don't ask for it. I know what some people do to get money. What? Bad guys. They steal money. Uh-huh. Bad guys steal money. And how about finding money? Is that a way to get money? Yeah. Well, you just find it on the street. I found a dollar bill on the street. You found a five dollar bill?

[12:22]

No, I found money. You did? I remember when you found a one dollar bill, too. And Ben just mentioned that you can sell things. You can get money by selling things. Is this all being taped? Yeah, because some people aren't here, so they can listen to it, and your parents want to listen to it, and you can't, too. So let's think of... Is that a blackboard? Yeah. So let's just think of all the ways we've thought of to get money. You can have a job. Do you know what it's... Kids, do you know what it's called when you get money for working at a job? What's that called? Salary? Salary. Salary. Salary. I don't know if you know all these words, but here's some chalk. What are you writing down? I'm just writing down some of these words that we're talking about here. I think you can spell them quite often. You have to read them quite often. Okay, good. Salary. Anybody know how to spell salary? No. No. No, I don't know. Salary. S-A-L-A-R-Y.

[13:25]

Y. Okay, now, there's different ways to get a salary. There's salaries where you're paid for every hour that you work. Or you can pay for every second you work. And that's called... When you work by the hour, it's called a wage. But I think working by the second. No, you're usually not paid by the second. You're usually paid by the hour. When you work for an hour, that's called a wage. When you get a lot of money, you can work by the second. Well, it depends on how much you're being paid for the second. Now, does anybody know somebody who works at the bakery in San Francisco? Um, no. How about Micah's dad? He's gone to work at the bakery, right? He is? Yeah. Oh, yeah. He's the manager of the bakery now. Manager? What's a manager? He's the person who's in charge. Oh. And people at the bakery, people at the Zen Center bakery, do you know what their wage is? What? $3.75 an hour. Uh-huh. That's the new wage. Actually, most people who work in bakeries make a lot more than that.

[14:27]

But people in Zen Center are taking less money because they want to help Zen Center. So, part of their wage is given back to Zen Center. And in that way, Zen Center can buy your food, and buy the milk that you get in the kitchen, and all the things that we get. My mom buys the chicken. Okay. That's a wage. And when you work for money, there's a word that refers to that, which is called earning. Earn. E-A-R-N. Right? E-A-R-N. So, what we're talking about is that usually the way people get money is that they work, right? Yeah. They have some job, and then for their work, they're paid some money. And some jobs pay a lot of money, and some jobs pay a little money. Like scientists get a lot of money. Yeah. Ivan and I were talking yesterday about different kinds of jobs and how much you get paid. And it isn't always exactly fair how much money you get paid.

[15:28]

But it is true that certain jobs pay a lot more than other jobs. And just some examples of jobs that pay a lot of money are people who make computers make a lot of money. My daddy makes pretty much money. He works in a winery. And, uh, yeah? And something like the people that run for famous commercials in the commercials and movies. Uh-huh. And you know who else makes a lot of money? Dr. Jones. Businesses. All right. Dr. Jones. Businesses. Managers of businesses make a lot of money. And the managers of doctors. Doctors make a lot of money. And you know who makes a really lot of money is sometimes? Dr. Jones. Athletes. Baseball players. Baseball players make more than the president sometimes. Did you know that? Yeah. Oh, my. It's like, like a secretary or something, but the manager of the whole thing. All right. You know why that is? Why? The manager does more. Well, because the manager usually of a business, like, let's say Ken, you know, is the manager of the bakery. Now, Ken has to think about all the different things.

[16:29]

Let's talk about the bakery. Have you all been to the bakery? Yeah. Okay. I don't know. What do they make at the bakery? Pastries. Yeah. Pastries. Bread. Bread. Cookies. Cookies. Pies. Pies. Cakes. Okay. What are those things made out of? Donuts. Flour. Sugar. Flour. Sugar. What else? Milk. Milk. Eggs. Eggs. Butter. Now, where do you think the baker gets those things? Some sort of store that sells those things, right? From a factory. From a factory or a warehouse. Right. And do you think that the factory or the warehouse gives the bakery those things for free? No. They have to buy them. They have to buy them with? Money. Money. Right. So, they have to pay some money to get the things that you make, bread, pastry, and pies, and everything out of, right? Donuts. Donuts. Flour. Okay. And then, people in the bakery put all those, you know what those things are called? They're called ingredients.

[17:30]

You ever heard that word? Yeah. So, you put all the ingredients together, the flour and the water and the milk and the butter and eggs and the sugar and all those things, and you make something. And then, when that thing is all made, people bring it out to the front of the bakery, and then they? Sell it. Sell it. Right? Sell it. Money. Money. Now, how do you know how much to charge people for, let's say, a loaf of bread? Suppose you charge people a penny for a loaf of bread. No. Why would that not be good? Because a loaf of bread is going to be that big, and a penny is only worth one cent. Yeah. And so, I'd sell it for maybe about, I don't know, maybe $5 for a loaf of bread.

[18:30]

Well, how would you figure out how much to sell it for? How would you know? Ben? I would take that. How many pounds? Let's hear what Ben has to say. I take the cost of how much. It's about how much money you spend to the ingredients, and you add a little bit more, and you'd sell it. That way you make a little money on each one. That's good. That's what it means to have a business. That's what it means to have a good business. And the people who manage businesses are people? This is what I shop for. Just a minute, Robin. I'm just answering Amber's question. Amber brought something up about why managers of businesses are paid well, because the manager is the one who has to figure out how much to charge for a loaf of bread. Now, Ben, you left one thing out, which probably you didn't think of, which is you also have to take into account that you're paying people to make that bread, right? Oh, yeah. That costs money, too. Actually, taxes. And taxes and other things. And also, you have to pay rent to the man who owns the bakery, because we don't own the

[19:31]

bakery. We just pay rent to the bakery, right? Yeah. So the bakery has to pay a man. I think right now we're paying $600 every month to the man who owns the building the bakery is in, and that's called rent. You all know what rent is? Yeah. Yeah. Rent is when you pay some money to somebody who owns a house so that you can live there. Ivan? Yes? Or you can do it on twice the amount of how the ingredients costed. Uh-huh. I suppose you decided to sell the bread for $20. Would that be a smart idea? No, no, no, no. Nobody would, hardly anybody would buy it. Why wouldn't they buy it? Because it costs too much, and other places you can get bread for $20. Yeah, so other people can sell bread for less. So you have to charge enough so that you make money and don't lose money.

[20:35]

But if you charge too much, nobody will buy your bread because they know they can get bread somewhere else for less. Or there's a way to get pretty much money. You sell it for pretty cheap, and then lots of people come. That's right. Now, do you think the bread at our bakery is really, really good bread or really, really bad bread? It's okay. It's good, huh? I like wonder bread better. You like wonder bread better, huh? Way better. I suppose people in San Francisco like our bread better than any other bread in San Francisco. They have to buy it. Does that mean that they probably pay more for our bread than for somebody else's bread? So part of what people pay money for is if something's really good, right? But is it fair to charge people? What? What? Is it fair to charge people? Well, if they want to charge more, they'll take advantage of it. You need to do that if you want more money.

[21:41]

Now, does anybody know some other places that the Zen Center has that make money besides the bakery? Greens. Greens is a restaurant on Ham Island? I'll probably sit next to what Shana's not there. Shana, you don't need to mount. Let's go to that store. Right near Zen Center? Yeah. The Green Grocer? Yeah. The Green Grocer? And also us are selling the thing down there on Sundays. Yeah. Well, it makes a little, and those are things from the field here at Green Grove. That's true. Tassajara. Tassajara. How does Tassajara make money? Do you guys know how Tassajara makes money? By people visiting. Yeah. They pay money to come and be there and use the hot baths and they eat food and they have a good time. And because they like to go there, people will pay money to Zen Center to go there. And does anybody think of any other places that make money?

[22:44]

There are a couple more. Really? Yeah. There's Elias Titchery. Do you all know Elias Titchery? No. The place that makes the zabus and zabatons and bat pants? I know that. No? No. Rusa, Rev's wife, works there. And Annie Somerville used to work there. Maybe you don't know these people. And lots of different people work there. And there's also, did you all know that Zen Center has a bookstore? Yeah. Yeah. And the bookstore makes money because we buy the books from the people. It's right here at the restaurant in Fort Mason. Oh, that one? Yeah. The great big bookstore. Over at the... Over at the bookstore. Oh, I've been there. I got, like, Tintin in it. And a bookstore makes money because you buy the books from the publisher. Publishers are people who make books. You buy the books from the publisher and then you sell it to people for a little higher price. And they make money that way. Now, guess what happens to... I got some books from that bookstore. You did? Me too. Good. I got some of my Tintin from it. Good. Oh, we sell Tintin books there.

[23:46]

That's great. Yeah. That must be a pretty good bookstore. And this is a whole bunch of children's books. Yeah, there's one big, enormous children's book. Uh-huh. There's Gabby's Books. Now, what do you think happens to all that money that Zen Center makes with all those businesses? They buy food. Well, first of all, it all comes together. We collect it all. And then we help... We give it to people who are in Zen Center, including your moms and dads, so that they can buy clothes and food and lunch boxes and all the things they need. Now, Zen Center is not exactly a business. And people aren't exactly here to make money. So we use a little different word other than salary. This is a word you probably haven't heard. Stipend. Yeah, it's called a stipend. What is a stipend? A stipend is a little different from a salary. Let me explain what the difference is. S-T-I-P-E-N-D. It's a race car. Stipend. You all see it?

[24:46]

Yeah. S-T-I-P-E-N-D. Stipend. Well, isn't it a half an hour yet? Right there. Stipend. Isn't it a half an hour yet? Yeah, we're almost finished, Sean. I just want to say a few more things about a stipend. A stipend is... It's actually sort of like a grown-up's version of an allowance. But they get much more money. Yeah, but it's basically what we all do. All the money that Zen Center has is put together, and then all the people in Zen Center share it. We divide it up, and we share it. And we share it based... It's not exactly everybody gets the same. It's shared on the basis of how much you need. Now, who do you think needs more? A person who lives all alone in a gaitan and isn't married, or a family with a mother and a father and three children? A mother and a father and three children. You think so, Arthur? Yeah. Because you have to buy clothes for all those children, and you have to give them what? Allowances. And you have to buy them popsicles,

[25:48]

and you have to buy their bus pass. And you have to buy their lunchbox. And you have to take them to movies and all that sort of stuff, right? And you have to buy the cook and stuff. Right. If you're living all by yourself and you don't have any kids, you don't need to buy all those things. So we share the money, and people get stipends, and the stipends are based on how much you need. Right? Like, my mommy needed a lot of money for Michael's dentist. Right. So do we help with that? A loan is raised. All right. So that's where your money comes from. I wanted to explain it to you because I wasn't sure you knew about that. Do you have any questions before we stop? Any other questions? Yeah. Do you have any ways you might suggest for us to get money? Work. Like wash clothes. Well, there's two different kinds of work, I think, in doing laundry.

[26:53]

I think we have to know the difference between them. There's the kind of work, it's just the ordinary work that everybody does, right? Like cleaning and cooking the food, growing the vegetables, things like that. And then there's special work that most people don't usually do. And maybe, like Vincent, some of you guys sold lemonade. Yeah. Well, that's the kind of special work that you guys made the lemonade, and then you sold it to people. And that's a different kind of work than ordinary work. Maybe we can think of some ways. If you guys think of some ways, you can give me or Mark or Gloria suggestions of ways you have to make money. If you think they're good suggestions, we'll try to help you do it. Ivan? Mike has made hot chocolate and sold it. Maybe we could do that. That's true. Just like the bakery, she has to pay for its ingredients.

[27:54]

What are the ingredients of hot chocolate? Milk. Milk and cocoa. Yeah, cocoa. Why did they get out of milk and chocolate? Milk and chocolate. Or water. Or water. Well, milk is good with, like, round chocolate. Or you can get a chocolate bar. Uh-huh. You can get chocolate bars. It's not as effective. Okay. Well, I think we can think of some good ways for you guys to make some money. It isn't like the usual work. Like collecting eggs. I don't think it's quite right. At least the grown-ups here at GreenGov don't think it's quite right to pay you guys for collecting eggs because that's just part of the work that you do. And any kid who lives on a farm should do certain things just because they're living there and it's part of their farm. Other things, like, for instance, maybe somebody could hire you to help clean their house

[28:54]

or wash their windows. That might be a good job. Washing windows. Or wash somebody's car. The window wiper. [...] I used to do that when I was a kid. It was so story. I love the window wiper. The window wiper. When you get as old as Amber, I hear Amber can do some babysitting. When some of you guys get as old as Amber, you can do babysitting for people. It's a good job. But usually you have to be about 11 or 12 before people want you to be a babysitter. So when you're old enough for that, you can babysit. Any other ideas? Selling pictures. Selling pictures? I did that with the e-tuck. You did? What did you do? Me and my friend drew some pictures. I know. And we had those different designs. And that was one of my secret projects.

[29:55]

Oh, really? People bought them. People bought them? Well, that's a good idea. Maybe somebody would like to do that. If there's anything you think that you do exceptionally well in drawing, like you can draw maybe two dozen pictures. And you can choose that from maybe one or another. Okay, well those are good suggestions. If you guys think of anything else, please let me know. And I think I'm going to... Or sell your old clothes. Well, I think that what we usually do in Zen Center with our old clothes, is we put them in the Goodwill so that other people can use them. I mean out in town. Out in town? There's certain things like that. Amber gets almost all her clothes from me. And if she gets a big box from me... So Amber was just saying that she had some shoes that she didn't have her wore? Yeah, I didn't get a chance.

[30:57]

That's because some of my clothes were outgrown. But you get to the museum. Yes, Simon? Well, like you can sell old clothes out in town. Like, I've heard of some good places called Ingles, they're out in town where they sell old things. Usually places like that have their clothes given to them by people who don't need them. I'd like you, if possible, to concentrate on things where you can earn some money by your work. Because that's the best way to make money. That's the way people feel best about you. And I have to go back to a meeting now, so I have to stop. One last thing. That's a possibility. Do you have to stop? Yeah, I do. I have to go back to the staff meeting. But I'm going to meet with you guys again in two weeks. If you guys have any suggestions about something you'd like me to talk about...

[31:58]

I'll write them down. You write them down or tell them to Gloria and she can tell me, okay? Some people have also... Some people here have their private garden, and they're weeding the gardens. That's right. That's a possibility. We could hire you guys to weed our gardens. Okay. Thank you very much. Bye-bye. Bye.

[32:27]

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