Welcome. So, this is the... Again, we're in the final section of Zen Mind Beginner's Mind. This section has to do with the wisdom teachings. Prajna Paramita. Wisdom beyond wisdom. So, as I mentioned last week, this section is titled in English, Right Understanding. So, wisdom is right understanding. And... Right understanding, focusing on the wisdom teachings, is the first step on the path to the cessation of suffering. So in the Eightfold Path, the first of the Eightfolds of the Eightfold Path, is right understanding, a right view. So right understanding includes teachings that lead to the realization of the Buddha's awakened insight. into some familiar terms for us, you know, to the understanding he had of no self, no independent entity hanging out in here like the puppet master, you know, pulling the strings, no self, nothing like that, no singularity, no self.

[01:28]

Then also dependent core rising, that everything depends on everything else for its existence. To exist, we need to have all of these things that are coming together to make each of us the way we are. It's kind of amazing. And I think the word miracle is not misplaced about the fact that we're alive at all and that there is life on this rock in outer space and so on and so forth. So we are a miraculous appearance, dependently co-arisen from all of these many factors that go into making up what we call human life. And then the other, so there's no self, Dependent co-arising, the next concept that he spoke about often was impermanence. So along with all of that, dependent co-arising, nothing that's dependently co-arisen lasts forever. It arises, and then it dissolves, and something else arises, and then that dissolves, and so on.

[02:28]

And then the other term that is a little more tricky for us to work with, but really important one, is emptiness. So we have no self, dependant core rising, impermanence, and emptiness. So this talk, the next one in the book, in fact, is called Emptiness, which is followed by a Suzuki Roshi saying, when you study Buddhism, you should have a general housecleaning of your mind. When you study Buddhism, you should have a general housecleaning of your mind. So a good place to begin cleaning our house is by taking an inventory of what it is that we've got in there in the first place. And as you can see from my house, I've got a lot of stuff stuffed in here. And what of it I'm willing to give away. It'll all go one of these days, but right now I have to discern how much can I handle, how much can I stand to live with before it's too much, before I'm crowded out.

[03:34]

of my space. So housekeeping has a lot to do with balance, finding the right balance between things you need, things you like, and things you're willing to let go. So the first thing that Suzuki Roshi suggests that we give away are preconceived ideas. And then he names a few of those, such as the ideas we have of substantiality or existence. These are big words, you know, we don't use them all the time, substantiality and existence. But those are two of the preconceived ideas that we base our lives on. You know, I'll bet my life on substantiality, that things will be the way I think they'll be tomorrow when I wake up, you know. And in last week's lecture on naturalness, Suzuki Roshi characterized existence as a moment of flashing into the phenomenal world, the world that we think exists. Just a moment of flashing, that's existence. A moment of flashing into the phenomenal world.

[04:37]

There's your impermanence again. Dependently co-arisen, impermanent. No self. Empty. So in our usual view of our life, we think... that we in the world exist, that we are truly here as solid, substantial things. I think that. I think I'm truly here as a solid, substantial thing, even though there's a lot of evidence to the contrary. We don't think of ourselves as events or processes. We don't think of ourselves as flashing into the phenomenal world, which in turn is flashing back at us. So such a world is much harder to take seriously. It's much harder to believe or to remember, and much harder to be possessive or to be loving. I don't mean loving. To love, possessive love, or to hate. Those are things that are harder to do when there's just these temporary, non-possessive elements coming together, appearing, and then going away.

[05:46]

So these are the facts of life that we struggle with, because... you know, when you look closely at how it is to be alive, you know, these are the kinds of things that seem actually to be true, you know, temporary, impermanent, no abiding self, you know. But it's hard because we're very attached to our existence and to the idea of ourselves as being substantial, you know, that we're real girls and real boys, right? So Roshi says that our view of life based only on existence on there being something solid and permanent, like a mountain or like the ocean, or like ourselves as we move about through the day, like our houses and our cars and our bank accounts, is heretical. Such beliefs are heretical. A Buddhist understanding of life includes both existence, so that side that we believe, and non-existence, the side we have trouble with, you know, we have trouble with. We can't conceive of non-existence, right? So the bird and the tree and the flowers and ourselves both exist and do not exist.

[06:54]

They mainly do not exist in the way that we think they do. That's an important way of understanding this. It's really about how we think. that causes all our trouble. The existence, just being alive, you know, it's okay. We all came here, no problem. You know, we crawled around, we walked around, we went to school, we ate our lunch, we did all those things. There's really no problem until we start buying into our story, our story of our ego and our importance and our position in society and all of those things that we've all been encouraged to develop and to then hold on to who we are. So, you know, we do exist and we don't exist. We don't exist in the way that we think we do. So last week I talked about viewing ourselves emerging out of the darkness, out of the unknown and the vastness into the light of the present. So every moment we emerge into the light of what we call the present, the present moment.

[07:58]

Here I come again, present moment. Here I come again, present moment. You know, moment after moment. This vastness taking the form of the present moment or a moment, taking the form of me. Here I am again. Here I am again. And it's a non-repeating universe. I cannot do the one I did the first time. I can't do the here I am again that I did the first time. It's not possible. I can't go back. I can only do something fresh, something new. We're very creative. We're always doing something new. Moment. After a moment. So Roshi then mentions the attitude that the Japanese people had before the Second World War about their culture and their way of life. And they thought it would never end. It was a pretty high culture. It had a lot of developed craft and a lot of ritual and profound unity. You know, the Japanese people had very unified feeling about themselves as a people.

[09:00]

And then after they lost the war, They lost that confidence, Roshi says, in their existence, the existence of the empire of Japan, the ever-expanding empire of Japan. And then they became skeptical. And he says that some people in Japan think that this skepticism is awful. But he feels that it is actually better than the old attitude they had about their superiority. So I think Buddhists are generally pretty skeptical. I think that's not a negative. That's not a negative for a Buddhist. It's like, yeah, that's right. I'm pretty skeptical. At least I think I am. You know, skeptics are those who question beliefs and dogma. You know, they're advocates for suspending judgment until more evidence has been found. You know, kind of scientific, really. Skeptics and scientists get along very well. And when I came to Zen Cerner, I was, you know... interested in hearing various things that skeptics tend to say like seeing is not believing you know what you see is not what you're what's actually there as i think we we know even though we still see things the way we we think they are but we know that there's vast worlds there swirling around and atomic levels of energy and all sorts of things going on that we can't see so skeptics are you know seeing is not

[10:28]

believing, or don't believe everything you think. These are skeptical things. Not knowing is nearest. Not knowing is nearest, is closest. I remember hearing someone say when I first arrived at the Zen Center that those who say don't know, and those who know don't say. which was, I think, one way that they kept a lot of us new people very quiet for a long time. Clearly, I don't want to be shown for the idiot I am. I don't know anything about this. So maybe I'll just be quiet and nobody will guess that I'm one of those who really don't know. I really don't know. So I read an article recently that said that in this modern-day view of skepticism is understood to be like an attitude, different than a, or not so much like an attitude or not so much like a way of life, but it's like a thesis. So skepticism is more like a thesis. And the thesis is that knowledge does not exist.

[11:28]

Knowledge is not substantial. So this is going way into where the Buddhists have been studying all these centuries, into the nature of mind and how mind is creating the world that we experience. It's my projections on the things around me that are making the world that I, relate to her, that I believe in. So I think it's really interesting to note that two of the Buddha's main disciples, Shariputra and Moggayana, the very early disciples of the Buddha, were both formerly students in a school of philosophy that expounded skepticism. So they very naturally fit in with the way the Buddha was talking about things. He goes a little bit outside the bounds of skepticism, however, and he gives us what we call the Dharma. or the truth and then it's up to us to discern whether that truth be skeptical he said be skeptical you know don't just take my word for it you have to look yourself you have to explore inside your own experience and find out whether what i experienced is the same for you otherwise don't don't accept what i'm saying and don't look at me i'm not the point the point is do you understand what i'm saying

[12:39]

Can you find this truth for yourself, this dharma? And then, of course, meditation is one of the ways we search. It's one of the times that we do a little time out on our regular way of seeing things and kind of look into the deep well of our existence and to stare down there into the darkness, the flashing, the watch for the flashing as you're sitting quietly there for a little while in the morning. Along these very same lines, Suzuki Roshi is saying in this talk that as long as we have some definite idea about or some hope for the future, we cannot really be serious with the moment that exists right now, the only moment that there is. So if we're thinking about the future, oh, I'll do that tomorrow, or maybe I'll figure that out. Oh, you know, I'll get around to that later, and so on and so on. We all have that tendency. I imagine. I certainly do. And I would imagine many of you understand that.

[13:41]

Yeah, later. I'll do later. Not now. The not now. You know, not now. So, you know, there's only now. There's only now what you do now. And it's this one flashing into existence right now. Maybe we could call it zooming into existence. That's something I've been doing a lot these days. So we're just zooming into existence and out of existence, you know, in another 50 minutes or so. And when we imagine some way of life or some structure that we can follow into the future, we may neglect what we need to take care of now. You know, we're all busy planning for what we might do later. So neglecting finding our own way rather than following some way that someone else has set up for us. You know, a lot of our life has been that, going into some institution like school or jobs where things have been set up. us and we just kind of follow the rules or do what we're asked to do and so on. Because there's nothing that anyone else can set up for us that really works for us just right, you know, some perfect way.

[14:45]

Because that way is going to be true for them, but it's not going to be true for us. So this is the challenge we have, you know, is to find our own way. And Roshi says that when we find our own true way, we naturally express the universal way. You know, we have found universal truths. We find the Dharma. When we really understand our own true way, our own true nature, and we follow the path, you know, that's been well-trodden path that many, you know, thousands and thousands of people have walked before us and have brought to us, you know, then we naturally express that way. It makes sense to us. Of course we would. You know, that's what now I think, oh, no, I think that's what's working for me better. what I used to think. And so that this is really the mystery that he's talking about, the mystery of how each of us, by being ourselves completely, and by doing things thoroughly, come to understand everything. Each of us doing things completely, expressing ourselves completely, and being very thorough in our activities, we will come to understand everything.

[15:59]

That's the mystery. So that's the kind of mystery that's being expressed by Dogen Zenji as well. He uses metaphors for this idea of this small unit like me being able to find the ultimate reality. You know, for the relative truth to be able to express and understand and realize the ultimate truth has to do with this shifting of perspective and this actually believing in the fact that we're much vaster. than our usual way of thinking allows us to understand. So Dogen uses metaphors for enlightenment, such as the moon is his metaphor for enlightenment, and the dew drop is each of us. So one of his poems, the book that has this collection of essays is called A Moon, The Moon in a Dew Drop. So the light of the enlightenment in the tiny drop of a single human being, you know, but not separate. They're not separate. He also says you can see the moon reflected in a puddle an inch wide.

[17:01]

So I wanted to read you a short bit from this famous essay. It's called the Genjo Koan. Some of you know the Genjo Koan. In fact, you can find it in the book called The Moon in a Dew Drop, among other places as well. Genjo Koan is like the whole works, or how the whole works, how the whole thing works. Kind of like a mechanic looking under the hood of your car. This is how this whole thing works. Just like this. And he's teaching us about how each small thing, each dewdrop, each of us, is completely attuned to and born from the entire universe. Flashing. So here it is. Enlightenment is like the moon reflected in the water. The moon does not get wet, nor is the water broken. Although its light, the light of the moon, is wide and great, the moon is reflected even in a puddle an inch wide. The whole moon and the entire sky are reflected in dewdrops on the grass, or even in one drop of water.

[18:06]

Enlightenment does not divide you, just as the moon does not break the water. You cannot hinder enlightenment, just as a drop of water does not hinder the moon in the sky. The depth of the drop is the height of the moon. Each reflection, however long or short its duration, manifests the vastness of the dewdrop and realizes the limitlessness of the moonlight in the sky. So I know that if you haven't read that before, I know that's not going to be intelligible, probably. But the vocabulary, the poetry is there. And the idea of the moon being reflected in a dewdrop is the main point he's making, that this vastness is reflected in each and every one of us. You know, the vastness that we are, the vastness that we are made from, and that that relationship between those two amazements is what we're trying to come into contact with in our practice.

[19:09]

Roshi then says that by understanding one thing thoroughly, we understand everything. By understanding one thing thoroughly, we understand everything. If we try to understand everything, then we don't understand anything, any one thing. So understanding one thing completely, we understand everything. If we try to understand everything, we don't understand anything, any one thing. So again, this is this dynamic relationship between everything and one thing. And how is that? By studying one thing. We understand everything. Can you imagine how that would be so? Can you think of something in your own life where you really applied your attention and your effort and your heartfelt wish to do a good job with this, whatever it is, that somehow you came to understand a great deal more than that one thing.

[20:12]

You learned something about yourself. You learned something about the power of your awareness and of your effort and of your heartfelt. you know all of that you know that's what we're looking for we're looking for that spiritual side of ourselves that side of ourselves that is basically is incapable of awe at who we are and where we are you know and how it is to be alive so to be of real help to others we need to understand ourselves the one thing to do that We need to forget what we have in our minds and discover something new and different moment after moment. So this is how to live in this world. Such true understanding coming out of emptiness arrives fresh and free. Housekeeping, housecleaning of the mind so that new things can arrive, you know, new deliveries.

[21:13]

Every day you have a new delivery coming. It's something we laugh about here a lot around these Amazon drones dropping packages in Denso Village. But it's not in the material plane. This is on the level of our learning, of our opening more and more to that which we don't know. Not knowing is nearest, nearest to receiving what you don't already know. Here it comes. Oh, I didn't know that. You know, how lovely, how wonderful to learn something new and fresh. You know, have room for something new because you're not blocked by what you already think is so. I think we call that narrow-minded. I mean very narrow-minded. So as we add these new fresh things to our experience, we can let go of the old things that no longer make any sense, and which are many. You know, a lot of things I remember I thought or believed or made me very unhappy, you know, and that I used to, you know, whine about a lot you know to anyone who'd listen these are just we're not right they weren't just going the way i wanted them to go and so on so we can just leave that old stuff you know just leave it leave the old stuff there it's okay you can put it in the attic you can put it somewhere else wherever but after a while our mind

[22:32]

If we do that, we'll become very overcrowded, you know, kind of like a junk store full of stuff. So maybe it's better when we have the chance. You know, we're trying to do that now with the actual stuff that we have in boxes, still trying to move it on. You know, maybe somebody else would like these books and these objects and these clothing and all this stuff. We are very happy to know that it was being used somewhere else by someone else who could enjoy it, you know, as I did and don't any longer. So Roshi then talks about learning to stop the sound of the murmuring brook, the murmuring brook, the creek, the river. Learn to stop the sound of the murmuring brook as you walk along beside it. Now this is a meditation instruction he's talking about, you know, in the same way as you learn to stop the flow of your thinking. So some of you may have had that experience, or maybe you haven't, but this might be something you can imagine, to be able to stop the flow of your thinking. to not entertain what's going through your mind.

[23:32]

I have done a lot of meditation and I wouldn't claim to stop the flow of my thinking, but I do know that I can basically allow my thinking to be that little brook that's rolling along at the kind of bottom of my awareness and kind of bubbling along there and trying to say something and I'm not going to listen to what it says to say. I'm just not going to engage in the train of thought. And it'll keep popping up little tempting little bits for me to bite. And I said, nope, not doing that. I'm just going to stay here in this kind of spaciousness. Breathing. Allowing myself to breathe. And just keep attending to that, to the sensation of breath coming in and out of my body, which is very helpful for calming thinking. I think those of you who meditate know that. If you... put your attention on your breath and you allow yourself to attend to your breath and basically train yourself to stay with your breathing that this is a practice for calming the mind it's called shamatha shamatha means tranquility so it's it's a well

[24:43]

known ancient practice for calming down calm the mind calm the mind before you do the next thing before you let that babbling brook come up and take your attention back you know see if you can calm the waters calm the waters and then dip dip in carefully to pick things that you you want to consider so dipping in is the second step of meditation is called vipassana so shamatha calm the mind and vipassana is reach in there now that you have a nice calm mind, you can see into the water, you can reach in there and consider vipassana, understanding what this is. What is this? What is a thought? What is a thought anyway? Well, one thing I've learned about thought in doing this calming and then investigating, vipassana means insight or investigation, curiosity. skepticism. I don't know what this is.

[25:44]

I really don't know what a thought is. I don't know. I think all the time. I don't even know what it is. So having spent a lot of time trying to figure out what is a thought, you know, the one conclusion I've drawn is it's very powerful. They're very powerful. And I should be respectful of thinking and careful and careful that what I think doesn't automatically come out is speech. It's not always the best thing to do is to say what you're thinking, but really to think about what's going on here, you know? So if we can't learn to stop or slow the river of thought, then we will be continually caught up in an habitual way of doing things. So this is one of the things, one of the tools of our trade as students of the way is to learn how to quiet the mind. and bring it down to very little bit of a murmur, a murmuring brook, you know, very quiet.

[26:49]

So at the end of the talk, Roshi brings up the topic of dualistic thinking, using the example of going one mile east is going back one mile west, right? So it's only when I'm caught, when I, as a point of view, am caught by some idea of direction, you know, that is relative only to me. Going east is just me. Someone coming the other way isn't going east, even though we're in the exact same spot. They're going west. So wait a minute, how can you be right here with me when I'm going east and you're going west? You can't really find this directionality on the earth itself. It's something we've created. We've made that up. If I think I'm walking to the east, then I am enslaved to dualistic thinking. You know, and to the substantiality of east and west and north and south. You know, those are substantial truths. You know, the effort in walking is the activity of walking itself.

[27:50]

Learning from walking itself. You know, left foot, right foot. Left foot, right foot. So walking on the round earth has no direction in it. to it at all there is no up down or north or south or east coast or west coast you know we just drew that stuff on over this big ball and we said okay now the ball is this way right and here's the north america and say well wait a minute south america's and how do we get to be south america let's turn the ball this way we'll be north america you know it's very arbitrary the hell that'll happen but we treat it as substantial truth you know that's north that's the north pole and that's the south pole in relation to what each other, you know? No north, no south, and so on. So this is deconstructing some of these language games that we have been taught, and they're habits. They're these habits that we have. So there is no up or down, there's no north or south, there are just footsteps leaving traces temporarily in the wet sand, you know?

[28:52]

That's us. I love seeing these pictures of National Geographic, you know, it's one of the feeds I get when I look at the news. And they have these footprints that they find in the mud, you know, from hundreds of thousands of years ago of humanoids that were walking along the bank of a river. And then somehow the silt came in and their footprints had been preserved for thousands and thousands of years. And there's these little five toes, this little arch, little heel. I was like, boy, that is just like me, you know, walking in the sand. Roshi then talks about meditation as having no direction or effort towards something else, something like liberation or enlightenment. We're not going anywhere when we're sitting. We're not trying to go somewhere else. He says that concentration means freedom. It doesn't mean exhausting yourself, trying to hold on or grasp some concept, especially some concept about a future or a goal, an ambition.

[29:57]

So therefore, our effort should be directed at nothing, non-directional, universal, unidirectional, 360-degree sphere, with nothing holding it back, no boundaries, just on and on and on. If we say to keep our mind on our breathing, then the way to do that is by, as Roshi says, if we say to keep your mind on your breathing, The way to do that is by forgetting all about yourself. The one who's breathing. Forget about that. The one who's breathing. Just breathing. Just breathing. Just sit and feel your body as it breathes. You just sit and feel your body, or the body, or whatever it's called, breathing. Feel breathing. And when you concentrate on that, your self will be forgotten. He then says that he doesn't know which comes first, forgetting the self and feeling the breath, or feeling the breath and the self is forgotten.

[31:07]

But either way, they kind of go together. Concentrating on the breath, just breath. Self is not there. Don't need it. Don't need somebody sitting there counting. One, two, three. Just... Inhaling and exhaling. And by doing that, that self is forgotten. Okay, so this is a very nice little complement there between breath and no self. He then says, he ends by saying that we don't have to try too hard. You know, just do the best we can. If we continue this practice, eventually we will experience the true existence which comes from emptiness. If we continue this practice, eventually, not continually, eventually, we will experience the true existence that comes from emptiness. Okay.

[32:10]

So, I invite you. You have a nice amount of time. I invite you to please come and talk to me if you like. I'm going to go on gallery. There we are. Hello, everybody. Welcome. Nice to see you all. I'm just going to glance around the block here a little bit. See all the familiar faces and a few new ones. Hello, Linda and Helene, Carmina and Marianne, Amar, Millicent, Kakuan, Dean and Griffin, Kate, Kate, Musho, Stephen, Lisa, Kathy, Shozan, Marie, Kosan, Cynthia, Jacqueline. Hi, Jerry. Hands waving. Tom and Zenko, Kira, Michelle. Laura, Meredith, and Irene. Welcome. Good to see all of you, new and old. Well, you flashing? Oh, that used to be a thing people did, isn't it?

[33:14]

Sorry. No, no, I'm not flashing. I'm trying to raise my hand, but you see how it comes. Oh, yeah, that was good. That was good with all those hands. Very handy. Very handy. I have a very quick question from last week. My notes say to me that you had mentioned, I believe, a book called The Minds Only Teaching by a chap named Ben Connelly. Connelly. Connelly. I remembered it. C-O-N-N. E-L-L-Y, Ben Connolly. And it's called Vasubandhu. That's the name of a teacher, Indian master, Vasubandhu. Mind-only teachings. They're the 30 verses of Vasubandhu's 30 verses. I think if you look up Ben Connolly.

[34:16]

Is it double N and double L? I think so. Anyone nodding? Double N, double L? There's some nodding. Yep, you got it. Thumbs up. What is it? Yes. Double N double L. Thank you. Yeah, welcome. Yeah, it's great. It's good. It's really good. And if you can find other people, here it is. I found it. Can you read that? Is it backwards? No, no, it's correct. Oh, good. I see it backwards. Inside Vasubandhu's Yogacara. Yogacara is the mind only school. which is highly influential in Zen. So the mind-only school and the emptiness teachings are the two wings of the Zen bird that makes Zen what it is, those two influences. Amr. Oh, wait a minute, was Kosan first? Oh, Kosan, I'm sorry. Good evening, Fu-sensei.

[35:21]

Good evening, Sangha. I had a moment today. Sundays are my Soji and Dharma day. And I clean the house and the yard and do as much as I can and attend to this meeting and then the Sunday talk. I was doing yard work today and realizing when I'm doing soji in my own home, I'm never just in the tasks. I'm always thinking about what needs to get accomplished in my day such that I can feel like the house and the yard are sufficiently clean for me to have a trouble-free week.

[36:24]

And I also realized that one of the great comforts to me of being at Green Gulch is that there are assigned periods to do things, including work and SOGI, and that rush is never present. That feeling like I need to complete all of the steps of cleaning the bathroom by the time the breakfast bell rings. That's not present. I just do as much as I can. And so I guess I'm offering to the group a question and specifically to you, Fusensei, is what kind of wisdom do you have around that? It's just... present with me in the lay world. Everything is production oriented. Everything is deadline oriented. Everything is do as much as you can within a given period of time. And actually, you actually have to complete the task.

[37:26]

Frankly, it's not acceptable not to complete. So I guess I'm asking that broad question. What do you, what do you do with that? Well, certainly welcome other people's suggestions as well as you did. Um, And I would say that, you know, that's letting someone else set the standard for you, like your job or whoever you're expecting, your clients, whatever. That's the world that you didn't agree to. So somehow you're being pulled, you're harnessed to some system that is really not maybe so suitable. And we've all done that. We've all been in those situations sometimes because you have to pay the rent. There's some simple things that you need to do in order to simply get by in this life. But, you know, there are ways and times when you can explore, like in your own home, what would it be like to, you know, to give yourself a certain amount of time and then you're done.

[38:27]

I have grown into allowing myself to stop work at four o'clock in the afternoon. done you know i mean i had an earlier i had an early get up so i was getting up very early and so i got a lot of stuff done before four o'clock but i felt like i needed a stop time because otherwise i do what you're saying i just keep going i can't find another thing to do and that it makes me reminds me of that and pretty soon you're just exhausting yourself and maybe not really appreciating all the things you just did you know that the delight in dusting the shelves And taking out the vacuum cleaner bag. And all those things that are kind of so familiar that we overlook how magical it is. These gadgets that we have and these brooms and these dust mops and all. So somehow, you know, regaining your kind of childish view of work. Can I help mommy? Can I do that? You know? And being the good mommy.

[39:29]

Of course you can. You can help. So I think one nice thing about going to the community now and then is that you get someone else to help you to appreciate. You're done now. There's the bell. You don't have to keep... Put your tools away. We'll come back tomorrow. We didn't finish that. We'll come back tomorrow and finish that. And we'll never be finished because the leaves keep falling. Right? We go out there and sweep and sweep and sweep and then... And the dust and all of it just keeps coming. So we want to find a rhythm within all of that, within transiency that feels good. And I think your breath is the very best place to watch. How can you work while you're paying attention to your breath, the pace of your breathing? We are shallow breathers in our culture, apparently. We breathe very shallow.

[40:30]

We don't breathe in our abdomens. Some cultures... Some African cultures and others are abdominal breathers. They breathe very deeply. So they're walking around all the time with these nice deep breaths, you know, carrying things on their heads and balanced and, you know, walking. That's good, too. All those things that they're doing, their bodies have an alignment that's quite beautiful to watch, you know. And you watch American workers or sometimes I just go like, oh, God, that looks so unpleasant. You know, I can see myself doing the same thing, you know, working out of whack, out of sync with my breathing. So deep breathing and watch your pace and try to notice what you're doing, how it feels. Anyone else want to bring in something you found that works well? Kakawan. Hi, Fu.

[41:32]

Hello, Sangha. And I wanted to thank Kosan for such a wonderful question that I face every weekday, I would say, out on the manufacturing plant where specifically almost as part of my work is making sure that I look busy because I'm at the client site, they're paying, so there's no... I certainly understand that rush, right? We need to finish this. There's a report out on Friday. There is no not doing it, right? And what has personally really helped me is recognizing that thoughts aren't necessarily bad, right? I think like Fu said, it's like recycling them is part of it. recognizing is now the time to think or is now the time to wash my hands or to walk.

[42:39]

That, that was a real gift for me. And maybe in your line of work, it's different, but even when I'm in an intense conversation or doing a training or whatever it may be, I always have to go somewhere else. And a lot of times it's just me walking and facing the people in front of me. So yeah, Those are the small, tiny moments where I try to feel my feet touch the ground, feel how quickly I'm walking, how my breath is lining up, and just those small moments that you find that I would say, and it's hard to look for, but it almost becomes habitual after you find it. Oh, I've been walking, and maybe it's right at the end, right? You're almost there, but these two steps, and then it turns into three steps, and then four, and then as... suddenly you start noticing, well, okay, when I walk in the plant in the stressful environment, there's still just walking happening. There's nothing else that I could possibly be doing right now.

[43:41]

My mind thinks the list is this wide, right? But there's just this step really. So that's been really helpful in getting out of the car and remembering to look and remember that there's a world out there because sometimes it's just, okay, Now I'm going to go and I'm going to do the work. And now, right, and then we forget, look at the beautiful sunset. Look at how freezing cold it is out here in Tulsa, Oklahoma, is where I currently am. But really taking that all in, and I feel like, at least for me, those small moments start growing. I remember I used to... it felt as everything happened in retrospect for me. Oh, I wasn't being mindful or, oh, I wasn't, I was completely distracted. And then more of those moments became, it's almost the lag got a little bit closer. Still live a lot of my time up here, but I would say those are the little things that really helped is scheduling thinking almost just like we schedule everything at

[44:45]

at Green Gulch, right? So now, and then remembering. For me, it's like the shower or remembering, no, I'm not solving this work problem right now. I'm not on the clock. I'm just doing this, washing my hair or whatever it may be. So that would be my only two cents. But thank you for great question. To continue the exploration, the mystery. Thank you, Coughlin. I think Amir, Amir, I think you might have been next. Yeah, I believe so. Thank you for that dopes of wisdom, Tako. I'm going to try to put that to use as I have this pile of dishes just waiting back here to be done. I wanted to give a shout out to the anniversary of Buddha's enlightenment shout out for buddhist enlightenment thank you armor welcome and um i wasn't sure if you were had a book planned next because if you didn't i was gonna throw out a something in the suggestion box what what what you got uh that that little pink book you just pinked up that's got like a million sticky notes in it

[46:12]

This one? Yeah. Yeah. It's like you've been through it a few times. Maybe you'd have a thing or two to teach us on. It's a really fun book. I'm happy to. Thank you. Thank you very much. Good to see everybody. Thank you. Thank you. Millicent, hello. Hi, Sue. I like that idea very much too, Amir. So there's two votes. Two out of two. And this very interesting conversation has absolutely distracted me from my question of Soji and how to work. It's reminded me of a very funny experience I had when I was doing a practice period at Zen Centre. And I was assigned to brushing the Zabattons in the Zendo during work period.

[47:17]

So off I went and I brushed and [...] then went to the work leader and said, I've done that now. What would you like me to do next? And the work leader said, brushing the Zabattons is what happens between this time and this time. I went back and brushed them again. And that was, I mean, all these years later I can still remember how shocking that experience was because it was the first time I had ever done a task where the product wasn't the reason for doing it. It was the doing it that was the reason for doing it. It was so inefficient. You've been doing that ever since? No, but I've remembered it, that it was the doing of it, not the final product of brushed sabotage.

[48:27]

The reason I put my hand up was from your talk, you, again, this whole business of dualistic thinking and everything, And my mind snagged at a couple of points. One of them is the actual metaphor that we love so much of the moon reflected in the dewdrop. It's such a beautiful image, but it's a reflection. It's a reflection. The moon is out there and me, the dewdrop, I'm down here. and that moonlight is reflecting in me, but the moon is out there. And similarly, right at the end of that talk, he says, if you continue this practice, you will experience, you know, guarantee, you will experience the true existence which comes from emptiness.

[49:38]

So emptiness is... over there, and if I keep doing this, I will experience that true existence which is coming from out there. I mean, this is a language problem, but I feel uneasy with this out there-ness because immediately I want to aspire to it. I get ambitious about it. I want to get there. So, yes, if you can untangle, this is a language thing, I know, but, boy, it's not helpful. Yeah, well, that's about directionality, too. You know, it's like the surface of the earth. I was almost going to say to you, hello from down there. You're down there, right? Yeah. And Australia. Yeah, you're down there from my point of view, and the moon is out there from my point of view. And I'm over here from the moon's point of view. And, you know, so it's all like a point of view.

[50:40]

But the point of view, if you remember Indra's net, that moon reflecting the dew drop is nothing other than the reflection of the moon. I mean, the dew drop is nothing other than the reflection of the moon, right? It is the reflection. Take away the reflection of the moon, then the dew drop loses its characteristic. And if you take away everything else that's making up the moon drop, the dewdrop, the moondrop, the dewdrop, then it loses its existence. It goes into non-existence. So where did the dewdrop go? It depends on the grass that holds it and the water that made the rain come down and then the moon reflecting it. That is the dewdrop. All of that is the dewdrop. It's not like out there. The moon isn't out there. It's reflected in the dewdrop. And the moon, for the moon, without the dewdrop, it also doesn't have its existence, isn't complete. So the whole thing is reflecting the whole thing.

[51:41]

There's no other place for things to be happening, like out there. It's all in here. It's just a very big in here, you know. We're very, very much connected. All of this is connected. You and I are... You know, I could say you're way over there or down there or whatever, but right now my experience of you is that you are me right now. I am you right now. I have no other existence right now than a conversation with you. Yes. You are the moon and I'm the dew drop and vice versa. Yes, it just seems, yes, that's very helpful. Thank you. Because it is so weird that the existence called you and the existence called me 12,000 miles apart in our bodies and yet there's no separation.

[52:44]

And it seems that this whole image of the moon and the dew drop and the emptiness and the true experience, they're separate. The moon is separate from... I know you've said that the moon only kind of doesn't exist without the deodorant, but I just feel... I think to think that of separateness. Separateness seems to, for me, trigger all kinds of ancient habitual fear.

[53:48]

Well, that's the cause of suffering is the belief in separateness. Yeah. And you're right. I mean, you know, the wheel of birth and death is Yama, the lord of death, of impermanence, permanent impermanence, like in the end of things, is holding the wheel. And we're afraid. It's a frightening thing, that notion, that idea we have of impermanence, of things don't last. That's what drove the Buddha into the woods. He was scared, like you. He was scared of that, of being separate. He wanted to unify. He wanted to become unified. with the gods. He wanted to be with the Lord Brahma as one unit, like light. He wanted to be a light creature so he wouldn't have to worry anymore about being a human who is vulnerable to old age sickness and death. And then he turned that around. He went back to reclaim his humanness. He said, I think I'm going to do this job. This is my job right now. It's like Soji. You'll never get done. You just keep doing your job of a temporary entity called a human.

[54:53]

And you do the best you can. And you'll have fear. And you'll have anxiety. And you'll wish to be somewhere else. Those are all human things. And then the Buddha keeps bringing these ideas for us to chew on. How about there is no separation? How about that as a meditation? That's my only safety. Right. That's our safety. That is our safety. Non-separation. Belonging. We belong. We belong here. This is home. We're home. This is my home. This is my home. This is my home. All of you are my home. And it's transient. I just moved in here. I'm in my home very long. So it's both things. It's existent and non-existent. It's here and not here. And here we are, you know, talking about it.

[55:55]

Yeah. As best we can. As best we can. Thank you so much, Fu. You're so welcome. Eileen, good to see you. Hi. It's great to see everybody. Thank you for your talk, Fu. When Kosan was leading our group while you were gone, she played some tapes that were by Suzuki Roshi. And I imagine that some of the tapes reflect the writings in the book. Kosan, is that right? Are they transcripts? Is the book transcripts of some of those tapes? Right. So from what I could see of the publicly available databases, including cuke.com and Embrace or Engage Wisdom, which is available through SFCC website,

[57:08]

The talks that are in the Zen Mind Beginner's Mind book are not available by audio, but there are transcripts. I'm not quite sure why that's the case. There is one or maybe two possibly. which I did play during our recess period that were from Zen Mind, Beginner's Mind, but most of the ones that are publicly available are actually from Not Always So. I was referencing a tape that you shared with us. Okay. In the tape, he talks about having a softer, flexible mind. Okay. I just wanted to say that really appeals to me when I get all grungy in my head. If I think about having a soft mind, it really changes how I feel and how I see things.

[58:13]

So, you know, he says, if you want to study Zen, you should forget all your previous ideas and just practice Zen. And see what kind of experiences. You have in your practice. This is naturalness. And then. He goes on to. Say that this naturalness. Is having a soft mind. And I'm very. That's very appealing. To me. Rather than. I prefer my mind when it's soft. And do you have particular ways that you bring yourself back to softness? Is there a practice you've been doing that you could share that helps you to do that? Well, when I realized that my mind is getting to be like a brick, I just bring myself back and say, you know, this is going to get you nowhere.

[59:22]

You know, there's no point getting all involved. And I just kind of, I go into a place that kind of resembles sitting Zazen, but it's not someplace I have to be for very long. It's just I can snap into that space and settle my mind down and go back to what I was doing. I don't mean that I have to sit Zazen. to come in contact with a gentler mind. I think it's always there. Yeah. Yeah, you just kind of remind yourself. Right. Yeah. Yeah, that's good. Yeah. Yeah. Thank you. Yeah, you're welcome. Hello, Dean.

[60:28]

Hello, everyone. often when people are talking, I'll hear something, I'll start thinking about it, and then someone else is talking, and it's sort of like, well, I have to let go of that to get this next thing. I don't want to miss the next thing. And something happened a little differently this time. When Kosan was talking, I started thinking, and I thought, oh, oh, I've got an idea about that. And then Millicent said, And I thought, okay, I'm going to let that go. But then when Millicent was speaking, the same thought came back to me. And it's about the word stop. I think stop is kind of maligned in our language. It's seen as something harsh. And a number of years ago, when I was taking care of my mother, who had full-blown dementia,

[61:32]

It was during the pandemic. Oh, no, it was right. It was started before the pandemic. This happened before the pandemic hit. But she had full-blown dementia. And I was at Berkeley Zen Center, and Sojin Roshi was talking. And I said, there's a problem. My mom will ask me five times, eight times, 12 times, when are we having breakfast? When are we having lunch? When are we having dinner? Oh, what are we having for breakfast? Mom, we had breakfast. This is what we had. Five minutes later, what are we having for breakfast? When are we having it? And I said to him, I get really irritated. And I don't know what to do. And he looked at me and he said, stop. Just stop it, Dean. And I sat there for a moment and thought, what the hell are you talking about?

[62:38]

And then it hit me. I just needed to stop. I needed to stop. She asked this of me. I don't need to do anything more. I can nod and I can say, oh, when you're talking to someone who has dementia, you can say, we're going to have it in five minutes. Or, oh, you love those blueberry pancakes. It could almost be anything, but just had to stop what I was wanting, which was her to be something or do something. And I've used that concept over and over. When I was thinking about Kosan, I thought when I'm doing something and I've only got, Soji, I've only got to the edge of the driveway to go. There's the clappers, though. Stop. Just stop because there's always more leaves. Or when I'm doing some work. There's things we have to do. Yeah, there's a deadline. But even with that, I let go of the stop.

[63:41]

I let go of the I need to stop. I want to stop. I do what I'm doing. And then that stop will come back. I've learned that the stop will always be there. Then when Millicent was talking, and I think what you said, you read somewhere, if I keep doing this, I will experience a true existence of out there. And what I thought was stop. What I thought was I have to stop something to experience something else. And so for me, I thought, and this is how it's been working for me lately, is I'm getting hurt a lot. And it's not a dart anymore. It's not an arrow. It's a stake. It's a big old wooden stake like you go after Dracula with. And what I'm finding, I can't always stop the stake from going in, but I can remember that I need to stop something in order to let what is happening happen.

[64:49]

And Melissa, when you were talking, I was thinking in order to let the experience of true existence happen, I've got to stop holding on to the stake or I've got to stop wiggling it around. How bad is it going to hurt if I do this? How bad is it going to hurt if I do that? So I don't know. It just brought up a lot for me about just stop. And when I stop, then I can see what I'm doing. I can see that I'm committing myself to my hurt or I'm committing myself to being the perfect person and getting every little leaf swept up or whatever it is. So I really appreciate being reminded by what y'all said, reminding me of the whole thing of, Jean, just stop.

[65:52]

Just for a second, just for a second. So anyway, thank you. Thank you, Dean. I don't know if you all remember, it's been a while since we looked at the 12-fold chain of dependent core rising, the wheel of birth and death. But one of the teachings is, because along with those links, there's 12 links, which cause our suffering, or the causal relationship that brings us to suffering. The one place, the weakest link, is right after feelings. So you have a feeling about something, a negative feeling, or those are the ones we don't like so much, negative feeling. And then the next step after the feeling is desire. You know, I want that thing to stop. That is too late. Once you have the desire, you're just going to complete the cycle of suffering. But when the feeling arises, the teaching is stop at feelings. Stop it feeling. It's like stopping, not a hard stop, like you would stop the car at a red light.

[66:57]

Just slow the car down, keep the foot on the brake, and then come to a nice, not a jerky stop, a nice, clean stop, and wait. When you have a big feeling, stop and wait. Stop, look, and listen to what's coming next, what's happening. Mostly, automatically, on feelings, we go to desire. I want that to stop. I want that to change. I want that. That's mine. We go through greed, hate, and delusion are the desires. But that follows on the heels of feelings. So feelings, we need to be really aware of what we're feeling and give them a chance to really permeate our awareness and try to understand, what am I feeling? Where is that coming from? And I think like... Helene was saying, I think that's the soft mind that is looking at what's going on. You know, there's a softness there. It's not like I got to get past this red light and onto my destination, you know.

[67:57]

It's like, just stay there with the engine running. So that, I'm glad you brought that up, because stop is a really important, and I agree with you, it shouldn't be a harsh thing. It's just, please stop. Please stop. Buddha said that to Uncle Imala, the mass murderer. You stop. You stop doing what you're doing. Okay. Senko, and then I think we need to go. Senko-san. Hi, everyone. Yeah, so I have a question about this thing. In a book, in a chapter, Suzuki Rosh said we almost need to have a housecleaning of our mind when we practice Buddhism. So my usual reaction to that will be, oh, I need to make sure my mind is cleaned before I practice Buddhism. But I figured for me, it's kind of impossible. So I feel like this process of house cleaning is very, very long for myself and very, very gradual.

[69:00]

Sometimes it's kind of stuffed up again and I have to do the cleaning again. To me, it's just very slow, very, very gradual. Well, I didn't... It's a never done project. I mean, you know, housekeeping doesn't get done. I mean, nobody ever finished housekeeping. It's one of those like mowing the lawn or anything else. Right. It's just, you know, like who was talking about? Oh, yeah. Kosan was saying like she cleans her house. She's ready for next week when she has to clean it again. Right. So it's just and the same thing with the yard. You turn around, it's all full of weeds again. So basically, this is a process that we're in of taking. inventory of what's in your mind so what is in your mind you know what do you got stored up there what kinds of things are you carrying around that you believe you know substantial so you kind of keep noticing what you got and that what what of that stuff is like old vestigial gunky skin that just needs to be shed i don't i don't need that anymore i don't need to come back to that again and again you know i'm gonna do a fresh i'm gonna start fresh here

[70:10]

You know, and build up more stuff. But then you learn the habit of doing your soji, daily soji. Sazen is a great soji time, you know, mindset. Just do a little inventory of what you're carrying here. And retune yourself to, you know, walking out from the dark space in the zendo into the light. And I never feel anything but a great deal of joy when I leave the zendo. ooh, green and blue and all these colors. And it's just an amazing thing. And then other things happen. Other stories start to come and kind of lose track a little bit. Yes. Yeah. But it's not a finish. You're not trying to finish. We're not going to get done. Right. I really liked how Millicent was reminding us about it's in a doing. Like, we tend to have a goal there. Like, I'm just so... automatically setting up goals, right?

[71:10]

And I just have to remind myself this process. I think it's really helpful. I've been thinking about that sentence, like finding goals in the means for the past few weeks. Then I forgot, somehow I forgot. And then today, Melissa said it again. It's like, oh yeah, that's right. Yeah, I have a lot of post-its around my house. Maybe I should do one. I remember that one. Yeah. Yeah. Thank you. Thank you. Oh, by the way, yesterday I saw Jane Goodall and Sevilla Earl. They came to Singapore. It's amazing. They're in their 90s. Jane Goodall just turned 90. Sevilla Earl is almost 90. So they were talking about how they see this world, the interconnection, this word they use a lot, like how we're interconnected. This patience and the curiosity they have for this world. It's like, it's amazing. Yeah. Wonderful gift that they've given us. I know.

[72:12]

Thank you. Thank you all so much. Thank you. It's wonderful to see you. Please feel welcome to unmute if you'd like to say goodbye. And we'll see you next week. Thank you, Fu. Thank you, Fu. Thank you. Thank you, Fu. Bye, Sangha. Thank you. Bye. Have a good week. You too. Bye. Hey, Jacqueline.

[72:43]

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