surpass penetrating and perfect dharma is rarely met with even in a hundred thousand million kalpas having it to see and listen to to remember and accept I vow to taste the truth of the Tathagata's words. Well, good morning. Welcome to San Francisco Zen Center. My name is Kyoshin Wendy Lewis. And today I will be speaking on the Chinese Zen poem, Sandokai. or harmony of difference and equality. And as I was thinking about this, I saw that Anshi Zachary Smith is going to be teaching an online class called Zen Foundations, Exploring the Sandokai that begins next Thursday, May 1st.

[11:25]

So my talk may be a useful introduction. I think one of the reasons I was thinking so much about this poem is that when I was the doshi, or the person who leads service, for a long time on Fridays, that's one of the chants we do. So even though I was just chanting along, chanting along, I think some of it started to sort of sift down more because I'm responsible. And I think there's something about ritual... Like as I came in, I'm concerned about giving a useful talk, but then I go around and I bow and something else comes in. I don't know what it is exactly, but we'll see how that informs the talk. This poem, Sandokai, or Harmony of Difference and Equality, is attributed to Sekito Kisen, and if you chant the

[12:32]

Buddhist ancestors, you'll hear his name. And he was a disciple of Seigen Gyoshi, who was a disciple of the sixth ancestor, Daikan Eno. And his story is recounted in the Platform Sutra. So part of this history is the division of Chinese Zen into two schools, the northern and southern schools. or gradual and sudden enlightenment schools. And Sikido Kisan's dates are 700 to 790, which is just about the whole 8th century. So he had a long life. And his poem was written, he wrote the poem, about 1,300 years ago. So here it is so present to us in 13th century. So the poem begins with an overview, and you don't need to be familiar with it to follow the talk, but it begins with an overview of what it is going to address, sort of like my saying, I'm going to give a talk today on such and such.

[13:42]

So it begins, the mind of the great sage of India, and that refers to the Buddha, is intimately transmitted from west to east. While human faculties are sharp or dull, The way has no northern or southern ancestors. The spiritual source shines clear in the light. The branching streams flow on in the dark. Grasping at things is surely delusion. According with sameness is still not enlightenment. So in order to thoroughly understand and study this poem, a person would need to be familiar with the sort of history and historical people in Chinese Zen, particularly the 7th and 8th centuries, as well as various texts and traditions on which this poem is a commentary and explication, and also its role in the development and the continuity of Zen and Japanese Zen, which is where we have landed.

[14:50]

So some of these resources... our knowledge of the schools of Zen and the Zen lineage, the platform sutra, which I mentioned, and the concepts of emptiness, the absolute and the relative, which the poem is very engaged with. And then Nagarjuna is a Machamaka Karaka, the heart sutra and commentaries, a work called The Awakening of Faith, Tathagata Garba, Buddha Nature, Abhidharma teachings, Taoism, Tendai Buddhism, the history of Japan and Japanese Zen, Dogen Zenji's teachings, and so on. So this very beautiful, simple poem is echoing all these teachings and these other commentaries. And Suzuki Roshi, Shinryo Suzuki, wrote, well, he gave a series of lectures, and those were compiled into books

[15:54]

Branching Streams Flow in the Darkness, Zen Talks on the Sandokai, which Zach is going to use for his class. And then Shohaku Okamura more recently wrote a commentary on it in his book, Living by Vow, a practical introduction to eight essential Zen chants and texts. So these commentaries imply that this is a very important chant. And in Zen history and in our practice and in the whole experience of insight. It's chanted daily in many Soto Zen temples and at the memorial of the temple's founding teacher and we chant it at the monthly Suzuki Roshi Memorial. And a version of the last verse, don't waste time, is painted on the wooden Han that is used to call people to Zen, which you just heard.

[17:00]

So all of this, this rich history and meaning and depth and concern about the teachings and how to explain them, is in this poem. So Suzuki comments in Branding Streams, some people say the Sandokai is not such a good poem because it is so philosophical. It may be so if you don't understand the background of Sikido's teaching and if your mind does not penetrate through his words. So over time and hearing some of these teachings in talks or reading books or something, you can develop some familiarity with what he's talking about. And most of us will just hear and chant and interpret the poem from our sort of personal experience or perspective.

[18:04]

And all of that's legitimate, but it's interesting to know where it comes from and comes to us. So the overall tone of the poem is a commentary on the interactivity of the relative... and absolute truths. That is, in the light there is darkness, in the dark there is light. So they both contain each other in a certain way or talk to each other. And this interactivity neither affirms nor negates either truth. They're both always in play. And I think... Most of us intuitively know that in our daily lives, but to study it and to consider how it actually works or manifests is what the poem is trying to encourage. So in studies of religion and spirituality, there are usually, there's found two tendencies.

[19:14]

One is the apophatic or negative. and that's associated with developing wisdom, and the cataphatic, or positive, and that's associated with developing compassion. They're not separate, but they're ways to see things or study them. And in simple terms, these could be referred to as study and application, and application is also something called praxis. It's, you know... practice, we say, and praxis is the Latin term. And in his teaching on the Sandokai and in many of his other talks, Suzuki encourages study. And apparently he tried to get his students to study. And, you know, I think that... I mean, I was thinking about, you know, he came from Japan and he... had a university education, and here he comes to try to teach people who have no background whatsoever in what he's offering.

[20:26]

And I think he just wanted people to join him. Here, just read this so that we can discuss it. And so I think that was his request, and I often have requested that of students who I've spoken to. Well, you know, why don't you... read this, and then we can talk. You know, how do we invite each other to engage in that way? But Suzuki then says, almost always, that zazen or meditation is the most important aspect of Zen endeavor. So I think his point is that, you know, study informs our zazen. What are we doing? What does it mean that in the Light, there is darkness, and in the dark, there is light. How does that get manifested or develop a kind of an intuition about how our mind and our body works?

[21:33]

So I think his point is that they are complementary, and that complementarity sort of gives both vitality. So the meeting or the interactivity of the relative and absolute truths and of the apophatic and cataphatic methods and study and application is what I believe the poem is addressing. So generally, I think one comes to practice out of self-pity. And at first, you'd think that self-pity is part of the first noble truth of suffering. But it's actually a characteristic of the second noble truth of desire, that wishing things to change or stay the same or sort of becoming apathetic about everything.

[22:41]

And the path to the deepest... aspects of practice often is based in sitting in our self-pity until we feel at home in it. That is to know ourselves intimately. And Suzuki says, Buddha's way is the study and teaching of human nature, including how foolish we are, what kinds of desires we have, our preferences and tendencies. Zen is difficult. But anyway, this is a difficult world, so don't worry. Wherever you go, you have problems. You should confront your problems. It may be much better to have these problems of practice rather than some other mixed-up kinds of problems. And I think, in a way, you know, that sort of brings us to practice and then gives practice its life for us, you know, these other... this kind of better-to-have-the-problems practice than some mixed-up kind of problems.

[23:49]

And he isn't saying that our problems are solvable or unsolvable, but that in the context of practice, they are our resources. They're just the aspects of the human condition. And that means placing our relative self-pity... And I think it's good to find terms like that so that, oh, you know, you see what you're doing. There's something clear to look at. So this relative self-pity, putting that into relationship with eternity or equality or the absolute, and Suzuki says the absolute truth is something we may think of as a deity. So the interactivity of the relative and absolute is a container for what might be called prayer or radical hope. And the container for this interactivity is emptiness.

[24:54]

And the absolute, or darkness, is where there is no exchange value or materialistic value or even spiritual value. So the prayer or the hope that is engaged there, it's not a bargain. It's not like you're asking for something and expecting it and being disappointed if you don't get it, and this is for yourself or others. But it's this conversation that's not based on bargaining. So when he says, we may think of it as a deity, to me that's something, similar to how people pray. It's not, you know, like there's a tendency to think that's a bargain. But if it's, and I think actually that that's what the story of Job is about in the Bible.

[25:59]

I think there's many interpretations of it. But it's about that your relationship to the absolute, it's not based on bargaining or rewards. or relief of suffering. There's some other conversation. And this is an aspect of pastoral care. And that's the effort of the spiritual representative is to offer a container for this interdependence of the relative and absolute to do its work. And that container can accommodate how foolish we are, what kinds of desires we have, and our preferences and tendencies, as Suzuki said, for anyone in the container. And so the role of a pastor, and in our Zen lingo, we say the practice leader or the teacher, but that role, it's, you know, not an arrogant one of I know stuff, you know, but it's to access a kind of bare,

[27:04]

pre-prejudicial state of mind while upholding the principles of professional care. So this container has some conditions about it in order for it to work. So I think, you know, again, I walked into this room and I did my bows. That's so that I acknowledge my... What is it? Non-expertness. And then I sit down and you hear my voice. So Suzuki refers to this in terms of love. And in his commentary on the first few lines, he explains the term ki. The capacity of the human mind has three aspects. Potentiality, interrelationship, and appropriateness.

[28:05]

So he explains that potentiality refers to both current and future possibility as in the possibility of attaining Buddhahood or even Bodhisattva-hood if we think in those terms. Interrelationship describes the interaction between a Buddha and someone with a good nature and between a Buddha and someone with a bad nature. An appropriate means applying good means. If you see people who are suffering because of their ignorance, because they don't know what they are doing, you weep. You suffer with them. When you see people who enjoy their true nature, you should share their joy and give them encouragement. So these three capacities inform each other. That's potentiality, interrelationship, and appropriateness. And for the second one, he says, so ki sometimes means the interrelationship between someone who helps and someone who has helped.

[29:15]

This is also called ji hi. Ji here means to encourage someone. Hi means to give happiness. Ji hi is usually translated love. Love has two sides. One is to give joy and the other is to lessen suffering. To lessen someone's suffering, we suffer with them. We share their suffering. That is love. And this love, it's an offering in the sense that there is no expectation of return or response as exchange. So he's not saying, you know... I am offering this, or you are receiving this. It's more that the person who's encouraged in their joy or supported through their suffering isn't asked or required to accept what is offered.

[30:21]

It's more this, both people are part of this. So he's... He describes love in the self another way, but the context is that interrelationship that he was referring to, which means that neither person is superior or better equipped for loving. They both need to enter the container that allows for this interdependence of the relative and the absolute to work, or to do its work. And I think this is difficult and rare. And it's something we're always developing, remembering, reminding ourselves and others that that's our job as, I don't know, practitioners, human beings, whatever. Okamura says,

[31:25]

Sikido's teachings on difference and unity are really about seeing our lives from two different perspectives as one seamless reality. So I think that this sense of the interactivity of light and darkness or relative and absolute is part of any experience of change or transition. And, you know, these are always happening moment to moment, day to day and so on. And at Zen Center in the last few months, it has just been one thing after another to put it in, you know, conventional terms. There's been a lot of changes and transitions and other things. The first group of retirees left and moved to Enso Village, and I'll be going there soon. And City Center, as you know, was closed for renovations, so some people left, and many, many people had to change their living and working situations, and all this adjustment, and these changes, and who is here, and all those sort of things.

[32:46]

For, you know, there were residents who left and they're making their adjustments somewhere else, but, you know, a lot of adjustment is going on for those who are still here. And visitors to the temple, as many of you are, there's no longer, you know, that access to the building and passing people in the hallways and that sort of ordinary kind of social interaction. So that's been, that's shifted away. And a city center resident took their own life, and at Tassajara, a Sangha member died while they were out hiking. And this is just in the last few months, all of that for us and for many of you who are not residents. And then there's the wider world events, you know. And holding all of this, and I think... that for many of us, you know, feeling some extra responsibility and concern due to our spiritual vows and our intentions.

[33:56]

And it results in responses that may vary, but I think all of our responses are true, human, they're sorrowful in some ways, and they combine both hope and despair. And when change or transition is particularly intense, time kind of moves strangely between past and future, and the present seems less accessible. And these events and these shifts and all these things kind of surface griefs and losses and joys and triumphs from the past, as well as a kind of a hope. for avoiding future griefs and attaining future joys. So Suzuki said, time does not wait for you, so you should go on and on following reality. You cannot think the same thing always.

[35:01]

You cannot always stop and think. You should just go on and on making your best effort. Sometimes you feel as if you are doing something good. and sometimes you feel as if you are doing something bad. But you have to accept that you are going on and on in that way. Then you should do something, say something. So as I said, I'm moving to Enso, and I've been in the midst of this transition, packing and doing all these things, and leaving San Francisco, where I basically have lived since I was a little kid. And... Even though I've lived other places, I've always returned to San Francisco. And the city has changed. But, you know, it remains so familiar. There are places I just go over and over and people I know and, you know, places I shop and the people who work there and the trees and the gardens and this neighborhood.

[36:08]

And when I go farther away, Golden Gate Park, most important, and other of these little neighborhood parks that I just, I just, I don't know. So that, you know, that daily familiarity and navigation will change, obviously, with my move. And I will need to establish new paths and places. And I'll also be leaving Zen Center, where I've lived and worked and practiced for 35 years. So moving to Enso Village feels a bit like dying twice. You know, once in leaving everything familiar in my life, including one of my sisters who lives in the city, and supportive, and then my actual death, which, if that doesn't happen in the next week or two, will happen at Enso. So is this sort of attitude facing reality, or...

[37:09]

wasting time worrying and thinking. I think it's kind of both. And as relative and absolute reality meet in all of this, because I have access to it and I purposely have access to that interactivity consciously, I think moments of peace and unsettledness just keep going back and forth. I... And I feel that that's what transitions are about. But to have that access, to always remember it, because many of you are experiencing and have experienced loss and change and endings in your working and living situations and in relationships, and the disequilibrium that can be caused by national and world as well as local events. and the fear and the grief and the relief sometimes, boredom, numbness, excitement, and all these natural responses.

[38:17]

But as I was saying, however any of us respond, this idea of impermanence and of the interactivity of the relative and the absolute can be available when things are hectic and miserable or ecstatic and liberating. And it's not a solution, but it's a perspective. In an article I was reading in the London Review of Books on Artificial Intelligence, the reviewer said, to be able to express new facts, language must be to some extent unpredictable, which sets an absolute limit on what a network can learn about it. To be able to express new facts, language must be, to some extent, unpredictable. And I think of how much language has changed since I was a teenager. The words we use, the phrases we use, the things we referred to, and then that same activity, in a sense, is happening, but it's been impacted by decades of the world sort of shifting and changing.

[39:33]

So I think that type of unpredictability is also related to creativity and evolution, adjusting to circumstances. And the more predictable we hope our lives to be, the more limited they will be, of course. And yet, predictability can be a good thing, knowing some things that are happening next. But that creative working of unpredictability is also... something to remember, you know, every time our familiar is upended. So I think, oh, you know, it's really beautiful up in Healdsburg. What am I worried about, you know? And that sort of thing. Or maybe I'll find things I didn't realize I was interested in. Who knows? All those kinds of things. And... In his commentary on the image in Sikido's poem of Arrow Points Meeting, it says Arrow Points Meeting in midair, Okamura says, We shouldn't negate our individual opinions, but we have to see things as a whole.

[40:45]

The most desirable condition is when both ways of seeing meet each other, like the arrows shot by the masters. If we can perceive a situation like that, we can be really peaceful. It doesn't happen very often because it's really difficult. So rather than, you know, seeking after peace as some imagined state of satisfaction, the point is to not waste time. That's what the poem says. Or in our version, I respectfully urge you who study the mystery, do not pass your days and nights in vain. So Suzuki says, Sugito says that if you practice our way in its true sense, there is no problem about being far away from the goal or almost there. Even though you work very hard, it does not always mean that you are doing the right thing.

[41:51]

The famous koan, every day is a good day, doesn't mean that you shouldn't complain if you have some difficulty. What it means is, Don't spend your time in vain. So, you know, in the midst of whatever we're experiencing and what I'm experiencing and so on, or imagining, you know, I think let's take, you know, that chance of thinking that today is a good day. Even while, you know, we experience some dread or some kind of... for things to change. And, you know, not a good day, as he says, you know, as being kind of comfortable, but as a touchstone to sort of accommodating the unfolding of what can't be controlled or predicted.

[42:53]

And he's, you know... emotional and psychological components can be overwhelming. And I think the world still, I mean, now that I'm in my 70s, I somehow feel this sort of radical hope that in some form or way the world does go on, you know, and sometimes it's kind of sweeping us along and sometimes allowing us to rest. And it's far from complacent. to say that, even though it sounds like it, because all that other stuff is still happening. It's not as though this is an escape. So Sakito's poem proposes a Zen perspective on the interactivity of the relative and the absolute, which is the container of emptiness, in which everything is included and which the relative and absolute converse.

[43:59]

through words and emotions and actions. And I describe this as poignant. The quality of this is poignant. And I recently read a description of it as, ripened melancholy combined with rituals of gratitude. So, you know, we don't have an alternative place to go, really. Because wherever we go, we take ourselves and all our stuff and joys and sorrows and everything. But in this container of the relative and absolute, that interactivity, and those are expectations and fantasies and the thoughts and emotions that accompany them, in that container, they can shift. and find groundedness or peace, and approach an accommodation with reality.

[45:04]

A ripened melancholy combined with rituals of gratitude. That's pretty practical, actually. Thank you very much. And feel free to move and yawn. off, whatever, and we're going to have some questions and comments. If you would like to ask a question, please raise your hand and I'll bring the microphone over. And we would like to invite people who may not usually speak up and ask questions to have the floor initially. Thank you. Good morning.

[46:21]

My name is Robert. I have a particular problem that I'm struggling with and it's with a neighbor. He is in the Satanism and we're having an altercation and he's bothering me and I'm trying to get out of that situation and I'm trying to make a different situation out of it and I'm trying to figure out what I can do with Buddhism. love them, and try to neutralize the tension between us. So I would prefer any helpful hints. Thank you very much. Well, there are situations where, you know, a matter of control is not so possible because there are some psychological things going on that are sort of intractable, sounds like.

[47:30]

So in those circumstances, I think you need a lot of help. Other people to sort of intervene and mediate. And, you know, even simpler situations require that often. But when it sounds like that's an extreme situation that you would need a lot of help with. So I don't know if that's helpful. Hey, Wendy. Thank you so much for your talk. I really was resonating with this idea that our unpredictability is sometimes a source of creativity and that too much predictability can be sort of stagnating and...

[48:51]

lack creativity. And then also this idea lately that, you know, I was like, yeah, everything's changing. We know that. But does everything have to change all at once? Like too much unpredictability is just pure suffering because, you know, the chaos is... as you say, one thing after another really doesn't give us a chance to, well, it makes our practice immediate every moment, and sometimes that's just not possible, I think, sometimes, you know, to absorb all the change. And so Kodo gave a talk on Wednesday night and mentioned that just getting up and going to the Zendo, you know, he spoke about sort of when Suzuki Roshi died, what did they do?

[49:54]

Well, the next morning somebody hit the Han and we came and sat and just... And so sometimes our forms are the predictability that we insert on purpose. So we do things in a predictable way just to have that practice. So I wonder if that's... Is that what kind of... keeps you going in the times of these? Well, I think the forms are the sort of predictability in which unpredictability can do its work. That's what I was trying to say about the container. You have the relative going along horizontally, and you have the absolute going on vertically. So... It's always happening, and sometimes you think, oh, this is too much, and I'm overwhelmed, and it's perfectly reasonable to feel that way. And yet there's this container you have of the forms.

[50:57]

So in that place you can then, whether you're literally having the conversation, you're creating the space for it. And that's kind of what I feel about... when I was referring to seeing the teacher or practice leader. And that container allows for that as well. And there it can be spoken of. And it's not always elegant. It's often kind of messy. But since the unpredictability is held there or it can be taken there, then it can do its work. and always know what it's going to look like. Thank you. I have a question from the chat. This comes from John.

[52:04]

And John writes, does the poem highlight wisdom in knowing when to practice faith or acceptance? versus study slash practice? When to do each? Is that it? Yes. Does the poem highlight wisdom in knowing when to practice faith or acceptance versus study practice? Well, the sort of Purpose is to, you know, it's like when you're, when you eat, you eat. When you sleep, you sleep. When you, you know, and so when you study, you study. And when you sort of do praxis, practice, then that's what you're doing. Then what's happening when you engage in both of those things or each of those things is that they start,

[53:10]

even though they're already working together, you start to understand how they work together and feel the sort of interactivity of the two things. The two things being myriad, but still. And that's how the... You know, it's very difficult. The poem has this difficulty teaching about relative and absolute and... emptiness has this difficulty, is you have to talk about them separately. That's how you come up with a way of understanding them, to take things apart and then either put them back together as best you can and see what happens, or just allow them to talk to each other. So one thing I found useful when I was first practicing was... In zazen, I would just pick one of the short chants.

[54:12]

Often it was all Buddhist and direction, three times. And I would just repeat it over and over because what that ended up being was a kind of focus of meditation. You can use the breath and that sort of thing, but in the noisy city, and it was very noisy when I was first here for... various reasons with the neighborhood and traffic and everything, and just repeating that. And then it became a teaching, you know, and I started to understand what I was saying or what the words were. So I think those are various responses I would have. Is that, did the person have anything else done? Did you have anything else to say? Good enough. Okay. You defined poignancy as ripened melancholy with bits of gratitude, and you also said it's practical.

[55:26]

Could you expand on that? Well, I think that... Understanding that life is not, you know, sort of a party or something like that, or that that's a legitimate way to live, sort of develops in us, or, you know, just even a wish to be always happy or satisfied is not either possible or practical. That's what ripened mental Kali is, to understand that. It's just practical to understand that that's... our situation. And then rituals of gratitude is very practical because it reminds us that we're related to everyone who's going through whatever, whether they're happy or grieving, just like Suzuki Roshi said.

[56:31]

So it's just practical. You just say, oh, this is the accommodation of reality. Thank you for your talk. You've been practicing and living and teaching Zen for many, many years. And I'm wondering, as you're about to embark on this big transition to Enzo Village, if there are things about how your practice interacts with this transition that surprise you, or are particularly interesting to you, and if so, what might those be as you... Surprise me?

[57:35]

No. No, I don't... That hasn't come into it so much now. I think maybe because I've been through so many transitions in my life and in my practice and, you know, changing rooms all the time and you go to Tassajara and you're changing rooms all the time and jobs all the time and everything's always changing at Zen Center. So I think these transitions, those happening all the time, are sort of... make this like, oh, here we go, you know, again. And at the same time, I think maybe the one surprise is that I'm sort of curious about what it means to move towards death very consciously and to be sort of separated from this mixed community and diverse in age and many other ways and then find myself with a bunch of old people.

[58:41]

Myself included, you know. And that's, I mean, I visited Enzo, and I have to say there were just a couple of moments where it felt like a prison. Everyone has these little passes, you know, that you have to carry around to get through, you know, one building or another. And, you know, everyone has, all the food is prepared and everything like that. So that'll be it. You know, that's the one big piece, I think, is to just be seen as someone who needs to be cared for and lose my independence in that way. But it's not a surprise. It's just like, oh, that's right. I am dying. So, yeah. Thank you. Thank you for your talk. The poem you read, The Harmony of Difference and Equality, would you mind reading that one more time?

[59:48]

It's actually a whole poem, but shall I just read the introduction that I read? Sure, yeah. Oh, okay. The mind of the great sage of India is intimately transmitted from west to east. While human faculties are sharp or dull, the way has no northern or southern ancestors. The spiritual source shines clear in the light. The branching streams flow on in the dark. Grasping at things is surely delusion. According with sameness is still not enlightenment. Thank you. Thank you for your talk. I really like that line about the two arrow points meeting when I heard it before. And my question is a bit, is it that the two arrow points are always meeting and you're okay with it once you realize?

[60:56]

Or is it that you want the two arrow points to meet and understand both sides of the coin in a way? Well, Okamura describes it as a story of two archery masters, and they're going to compete. And what they end up doing is they both shoot the arrows, and the arrows meet. So it's kind of about how we have this idea of things being sort of always adversarial, Like we're trying for something or we're reaching for something or we have to be better or the best or the worst or whatever. We're categorizing everything in that way. But when arrow points me head on, what is that to do with the power of skill?

[61:57]

You know, it's kind of this kind of all of that competition and worry and self-worth and everything that was going on. And he says it doesn't happen very often. So does that... I wasn't quite sure what you were asking, so I'm not sure. Thank you. Thank you for your talk. I have kind of a curiosity question, picking up on Buddha, that the poem starts with. the teachings of Buddha, and then also, of course, the north-south, the gradual realization and the instant realization, and then again, a little bit personal, but having access to, I mean, just passing familiarity, maybe even very limited, but like Vajrayana, for example, right? And then also passing familiarity and hearing Zen.

[62:59]

You know, I can't quite hear it. Where do Zen and Vajrayana and maybe this poem... Where do they intersect, maybe, or if they do at all? Yeah, I would guess that there's not a direct correlation, if I understand your question. But interestingly enough, I am very interested in teaching a class on Tantric Buddhism. So there may be something about how that... how our experience of these teachings works. Like there's the thought about it, the study, and then our experience meditating. But what's actually going on? How do we accommodate it and stuff like that? And I don't think this poem so much goes into that, but it does describe

[64:00]

give you that container, this sense of the relative and the absolute and the dark and the light. Yes, thank you. We have another question online. This comes from Griffin at Enzo. Griffin writes... I knew the refuge I found at City Center and lost that at ENSO. Can I trust a more diverse, large community at ENSO? For refuge, it's as big as the world without the support of forms. I feel it's my pride that is the obstacle and requires a new humility. Yes, I've been wondering about loss of the sort of space of what we experience.

[65:16]

And, you know, a lot of our life at Zen Center is not all wonderful, but it's in this context of some sort of listening for others and listening to ourselves. And I've wondered, too, about moving to a sort of a vague community where that's not the case and what that will be like. So we shall see. Maybe we can create a mini internal community or something with you, Griffin, and some other people. But I do think it'll take a while to create a new community. Oh, goodness. Really, you have to have a lot of... What is it exactly? Learn new ways to tolerate each other and the circumstances and your own stuff.

[66:25]

So, yeah, it should be interesting. And we're always creating new community here. Always. It's always, again, it's always changing and our relationships are always changing. So perhaps that's a good sign for our ENSO as well. So did Griffin have any response? I think that's all the time we have. Okay. I was just thinking. May our intention equally extend to everything and place with

[67:35]

The truth is that it's all, but it's waiting. The kings are numerous. All I've been brought to you to say to them, they put you all in trustable. All I've been brought to you and to them, that my beauty is all about this. ... [...] Good morning, everyone.

[69:53]

My name is Kevin. I'm the Eno here at City Center, or the head of the Zendo, and I have a few announcements. As always, you're invited to come and practice with us here at City Center for Zazen. We have morning Zazen. We have late afternoon Zazen, Dharma Talks, other events. We're very glad you joined us this morning, and please come and visit us again. Our schedule is completely on our website. Everything that we do So check that out, sfzc.org. Some other events. Last Monday was Earth Day, and we celebrated the spirit of the day by having a ceremony and then going out to pick up trash around the neighborhood, and we loved it. So we decided to do it every week, make it a weekly event every Monday. So every Monday from 9.15, we'll head out for 30 to 40 minutes or so, and pick up trash in the neighborhood. And everybody is welcome to come and join us if your schedule allows.

[70:55]

So if you're going to go for tea and cookies, you'll go to the conference center. So we'll meet in front of the conference center at 9.15 Monday mornings and head out to beautify our neighborhood. Next Wednesday, instead of our usual Dharma talk, we'll have a special event, a community meeting entitled Building the Spiritual Community of the Future. with various speakers, and that will start here at 7.30 p.m. All are welcome to attend this special discussion. Our next one-day sit will be next month, May 11th, at the Haight Street Art Center because, as you know, our building is under renovation. The Art Center is right near Haighton Laguna, and you can register for that on our website. Sunday afternoon, May 19th, we'll have a special event right here in the Zendo. The group Kohaku, which is a traditional Japanese arts group comprised of two Japanese women, Sawako and Rieko, will perform traditional Japanese music and dance.

[72:07]

A wonderful family-friendly event Sunday afternoon from 2 to 4. There will also be some group participation, so you could bust out your Japanese traditional dance moves and join the performance. Let's see what else. There will be tea and cookies in the conference center right next door as soon as we're done here. You're welcome to stay and mingle. Please join us. Urban Gate Sangha is our Saturday Sangha that takes care of all the bells and sounds that you hear for Zazen before this and also for the Dharma Talk. Can the members of Urban Gate raise their hands? So all these people who have their hands raised have come to volunteer to support Zen Center. If you would like to be one of those people, all the people who raise their hands, when you see them at Tea and Cookie, you say, hey, I'd like to support Urban Gate Sangha. I'd like to hit a bell sometimes.

[73:08]

So talk to them and you can do that. We also have an event today and I'm going to introduce Shoko, who will tell you about that. It will be a little bit later. Hi, everyone. Thanks again for coming. As Kevin mentioned, there are lots of ways to get involved with Zen Center and support us with your time, talent, or treasure. One of those ways is to become a member of Zen Center, and you can do that on our website. And today, we are having a very special event that I'd like to invite anyone. If you're interested in coming, it would be great. It starts at 1.30, so plenty of time to go... have tea and cookies and even get a lunch. But at 1.30, we're hosting a guest speaker named Scott Neeson, who is the founder of a worldwide charity called Cambodian's Children Fund.

[74:18]

And Scott has a very interesting story, having been... president of 20th Century Fox International, and then having a complete change of life and moving to Cambodia to just care for some children that were living in a landfill. And it completely left his, you know, top of the heap. you could say, a job in order just to help people. So it's a very interesting story. And Scott, Mr. Neeson, is very used to speaking to huge groups. And this is going to be 20 or 30 people and a very intimate discussion. And I think there'll be a lot of teaching on generosity and how it can really change lives. There are more spaces left.

[75:20]

If you would just like to come to the conference center at 1.30, it'll be an hour and a half or so, probably. Anyway, thank you so much for your attention. Feel free to have a lot of tea and a lot of cookies to fill up that time between now and 1.30. So that's it. That's it for today. Thank you so much for coming. It's always a pleasure to have you here. If a few people could stay behind and help me put the Zendo back together and to help Burke and Tabriz, our trusty audio-visual people, help close that down, that would also be very much appreciated. So thank you very much.

[75:59]

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